Closed Bug 463444 Opened 16 years ago Closed 15 years ago

[vi] The "Getting Started" page for Vietnamese

Categories

(Mozilla Localizations :: vi / Vietnamese, defect)

Product:
Mozilla Localizations
Component:
vi / Vietnamese
Type:
defect
Priority:
Not set
Severity:
normal

Tracking

(Not tracked)

Status:
RESOLVED FIXED

People

(Reporter: Pike, Unassigned)

References

(
URL
)

Details

(Keywords: productization)

Attachments

(2 files)

Official logos from the website owners!
96.64 KB, application/x-zip-compressed
Details
New logo
4.90 KB, application/x-zip-compressed
Details 
A new Firefox profile includes a link to the "Getting started" page on the Bookmarks toolbar. The objective of this page is to provide the users with a few task-based starting points. They could use them to enjoy the web and discover sites that will help them get the most out of Firefox, and the Internet in general. This page will be aimed towards beginning and intermediate Web users. We want to promote community/user oriented collaborative sites with good user experience in your region and language, and good standards support.

The current en-US defaults for this page are:
 The 'Work' category: Google Docs, Remember the Milk, LinkedIn, Clipmarks Add-on
 The 'Learn' category: Wikipedia, Topix, HowStuffWorks.com, Answers Add-on
 The 'Play' category: YouTube, Hype Machine, Miro, PicLens Add-on
 The 'Connect' category: Criagslist, Yelp, Facebook, Me.dium Add-on 

(See the en-US page at http://www.mozilla.com/en-US/firefox/central/.)

We would like to provide a good set of links on this page for our Vietnamese users.

First, the localization team and Stas (Stas Malolepszy) will look at the market for your language and come up with a good candidates. Hung, we'll need your input on this, of course. The guidelines for making recommendations are on https://wiki.mozilla.org/Firefox_web_services_guidelines.

Second, once we have a good list of candidates, your localization team will localize the 'Getting Started' index.html file which can be found here: http://viewvc.svn.mozilla.org/vc/projects/mozilla.com/trunk/en-US/firefox/central/index.html?revision=18714&content-type=text%2Fplain changing the en-US default as agreed in the first step.

The logos should be named sites-<sitename>.png and should be 110px wide and 65px high on white or transparent background. Stas can help on getting the logos from the website owners.

The localized index.html and the logos should be then attached in a ZIP archive to this bug, and a review should be requested from Stas (stas@mozilla.com) and Pascal (pascalc@gmail.com). Once the review have been granted, Pascal will take over to push the localized page on the server.

Thank you.
Of the listed services, the following have Vietnamese-language versions:

Learn: Wikipedia (http://vi.wikipedia.org/ )
Connect: Facebook (after logging in, the Translation application is required)
Here are my suggestions:

1. The 'Work' category:
Google Docs (http://docs.google.com/?hl=vi ) - has Vietnamese version, but it seems that Google doesnt automatically change the language, need to change manually.
Remember the Milk - there's a community translating this site into Vietnamese
Vietnamworks (http://www.vietnamworks.com.vn)
Adblock Plus Add-on

2. The 'Learn' category:
Wikipedia (http://vi.wikipedia.org/) - Vietnamese version
Viet-Studies (http://www.viet-studies.info)
Bookilook (http://www.bookilook.com/)
Vietnamese Dictionary Add-on.

3. The 'Play' category:
Youtube
Zing MP3 (http://mp3.zing.vn/)
Thổ Địa (http://www.thodia.vn)
Easy DragToGo Add-on

4. The 'Connect' category:
Facebook (http://www.facebook.com) - just as Minh said, need to install Translation application to see Vietnamese
Nhạc Cổ Điển (http://www.classicalvietnam.info)
Game VN (http://gamevn.com/)
Tab Mix Plus Add-on.
The Vietnamese Dictionary addon (https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/7479) has been in the Sandbox since June. It should be approved before we can put it on the Getting Started page, because I'm not sure a new user would be inclined to sign up at AMO right away just to download it. I'll release another version within the next couple weeks.
2. 'Learn':
NOT Bookilook (http://www.bookilook.com/), it is a book search engine for copyrighted book, I think Mozilla won't agree with the idea using a copyright violation page.

3. 'Play':
+ Clip.vn (http://clip.vn/)
Component: Other → vi / Vietnamese
QA Contact: vietnamese.vi
Hello,

I notice that some locales include 4 or 5 sites in one category[1]. They even replace Google Docs with another site[2]. So, may we do the same thing for our locale? 

http://ku.www.mozilla.com/ku/firefox/central/#feature-learn
http://ga-ie.www.mozilla.com/ga-IE/firefox/central/
Interesting, the Irish Gaelic version links to various other open source projects, such as OpenOffice.org. Maybe we could do that, since there are Vietnamese localizations of OOo (http://vi.openoffice.org/) and others.
(In reply to comment #5)
> So, may we do the same thing for our locale? 

Yes, certainly. 

If you can have some objective metrics or reasons as to why you are showcasing the sites you choose, that will be important for your community to understand how decisions for the vi site design are being made.
As Gen said, of course you can, if you think there more good choices for this page. We try to keep 3 or 4 links per category not to make the page too long, though (which makes some of the content appear below the fold on some screens). Also, giving too much links may be sometimes confusing, so I think we should try to be reasonable about the number of websites that we link to :) After all, this page is supposed to help users start using the Web or start getting the most of it thanks to Firefox, and I believe giving a few (but not too many) very solid starting points is really important to our users. 

Re: Irish: please see bug 428171 for context. This was Kevin's initiative and we really loved it. We did something similar for Esperanto (bug 428165). If you feel that giving something more cultural makes more sense for Vietnamese users (because, for example, there's significant number of people living outside of Vietnam), then we will be happy to support this idea. 

Also, sorry for being quiet lately. I will review the suggestions made above really soon. Thanks!
Hello,

In facts, my team members rarely get to Vietnamese websites, they are now living in different countries: US, German, Russia, Romania. Only me in Vietnam, but still I don't know if I know all good sites. That's why I decided to refine the list. These days I've been going around some popular forums to know what people say about their favorite websites.

Vietnam is a young population country, 60% of the population are young. There was a survey from ACNielsen in 2006 indicated that 75% Internet users in Vietnam read news, 50% play games, 30% just chat and send emails to others(!), 20% get to study and research pages...

So I tried to stick to those statistics to recommend what's more suitable to Vietnamese.

1. The 'Work' and "Open Source Softwares' category:
Mozilla Việt Nam (http://vi.mozdev.org/) - Minh and we agreed to maintain this site to promote Mozilla in Vietnam.
Ubuntu Việt Nam (http://www.ubuntu-vn.com/) - Ubuntu community of Vietnam
Diễn Đàn Tin Học (http://www.ddth.com/) - the largest IT community of Vietnam
Remember The Milk (http://www.rememberthemilk.com/) - I helped translating this site into Vietnamese! Don't know if it's useful, though. If 5 links are more than enough, then this one may be removed from the list.
CyVee (http://www.cyvee.com) - LinkedIn of Vietnam.
_Adblock Plus Add-on

I removed Google from the list. Because Google is the king of web services here, everyone loves Google, Google is in everyone's mind! :D I think they would type "docs.google.com", "docs google", "google notebook", etc... directly into the address bar, rather than get to a page, wait for the page loading, then click "Google Docs" link.

2. The 'Learn' category:
Wikipedia (http://vi.wikipedia.org/) - Vietnamese version.
Viet-Studies (http://www.viet-studies.info) - Aldaily.com of Vietnam, also the same editor. Great site!
DoanhNghiep24g (http://www.doanhnghiep24g.vn/) - provides nice articles and reviews on economics and the economy.
Việt Nam Thư Quán (http://vnthuquan.net/) - culture related - archive of new and old Vietnamese literature, Vietnamese food cooking guides, etc...
_Webmail Notifier Add-on.

3. The 'Play' category:
Clip.vn (http://www.clip.vn/) - YouTube of Vietnam.
Zing MP3 (http://mp3.zing.vn/) - most favorite music site.
SànNhạc (http://www.sannhac.com/) - a web-based karaoke site. Yeah, just like Japan, karaoke is the most favorite entertainment in Vietnam, even the old people like it! On this site, the top 2nd most active member is a middle-age man.
_Easy DragToGo Add-on

4. The 'Connect' category:
Facebook (http://www.facebook.com/) - now available in Vietnamese!
Thổ Địa (http://www.thodia.vn) - Yelp of Vietnam. It's quite interesting because "Thổ Địa" means "The God of Land (Ground/Soil)" who knows about everything happens on the land of a region.
TruongTon (http://truongton.net/) - the most popular forum in Vietnam.
Nhạc Cổ Điển (http://www.nhaccodien.info) - where people share their emotion about classical music, we will also host the blog of the Firefox localization team there.
_Tab Mix Plus Add-on.

By the way, the GT template file in this bug is a bit different from the template in bug 463447. Which should I choose to translate?
For Facebook, we should use http://vi-vn.facebook.com/ , which points directly to the Vietnamese version. They don't appear to select a language automatically based on general.useragent.locale.
Yes right, thanks for pointing out, Minh. (Btw, I've sent an email regarding your Vietnamese Dictionary addon, hope it wouldn't go into bulk mail again)

Staś, you said on bug 463441 that you will review that bug tomorrow, then would you review this bug as well? Thanks.
Just a small change: instead of Webmail Notifier, we'll use AVIM addon - an input method editor (IME) for Vietnamese - developed by Minh.
Just a note, AVIM is not developed by only Minh (http://vi.wikipedia.org/wiki/MediaWiki:Him.js) . If it is an Firefox add-on, let Minh grant an official license before telling who is the creator.
We already knew about that! I said "developed by Minh" - with the big impression that he made it available as an addon for Firefox and because he is known as a commenter on this bug, not "developed by *ONLY* Minh". I just avoided mention of too many people on this bug.
Hopefully this page clarifies the licensing situation:

http://www.1ec5.org/software/avim/#license

The a.m.o listing names both Hiếu and me as developers; I don't think it's necessary to go into all the details on the Getting Started page. AVIM's license should already be permissive enough for Mozilla to use; if not, I'll talk to Hiếu about relicensing it.
Ping?
Working on this today, thanks! (And sorry for a small lag.)
(In reply to comment #9)
> In facts, my team members rarely get to Vietnamese websites, they are now
> living in different countries: US, German, Russia, Romania. Only me in Vietnam,
> but still I don't know if I know all good sites. That's why I decided to refine
> the list. These days I've been going around some popular forums to know what
> people say about their favorite websites.

Thanks a lot for doing this extended research. All these websites look very promising to me! I only have a couple of comments regarding the 'Work' category, all other suggestions are really great (I should probably start using them as examples to follow! :)
 
> 1. The 'Work' and "Open Source Softwares' category:

The purpose of the Getting Started page is to provide users new to the Web with a couple of starting points, which will help them get the most of the Web and Firefox. This is why I suggest a few changes below.

> Mozilla Việt Nam (http://vi.mozdev.org/) - Minh and we agreed to maintain this
> site to promote Mozilla in Vietnam.

Well, they already downloaded and installed Firefox, shouldn't we help them to get started with the Web?

> Ubuntu Việt Nam (http://www.ubuntu-vn.com/) - Ubuntu community of Vietnam

OK, but I kind of liked the Vietnamworks site as well.

> Diễn Đàn Tin Học (http://www.ddth.com/) - the largest IT community of Vietnam

Is this interesting to users who are not technical-savvy?

> Remember The Milk (http://www.rememberthemilk.com/) - I helped translating this site into Vietnamese! Don't know if it's useful, though. If 5 links are more than enough, then this one may be removed from the list.

I like this suggestion, plus it's localized, so why not? :)

> CyVee (http://www.cyvee.com) - LinkedIn of Vietnam.

Cool.

> _Adblock Plus Add-on

This add-on may be perceived as controversial by some people, so we'd like to go for something different here, please.

I would actually suggest these three websites:
* Vietnamworks
* CyVee
* Remember The Milk

and maybe we could add a fourth link (Google Docs, Ubuntu?). I think that what we're trying to do here is to help users start using the web and these three (four) websites seem to get this job done well. What do you think?

> I removed Google from the list. Because Google is the king of web services
> here, everyone loves Google, Google is in everyone's mind! :D I think they
> would type "docs.google.com", "docs google", "google notebook", etc... directly into the address bar, rather than get to a page, wait for the page loading, then click "Google Docs" link.

Well, there's an assumption in what you say that the user will know Google Docs, whereas the Getting Started page is primarily intended for new users, who are new to the Web and Firefox. I think linking to Google Docs can have this nice "wow" effect, when you think "This is a cool webapp!" :)

> 2. The 'Learn' category:
> Wikipedia (http://vi.wikipedia.org/) - Vietnamese version.
> Viet-Studies (http://www.viet-studies.info) - Aldaily.com of Vietnam, also the
> same editor. Great site!
> DoanhNghiep24g (http://www.doanhnghiep24g.vn/) - provides nice articles and
> reviews on economics and the economy.
> Việt Nam Thư Quán (http://vnthuquan.net/) - culture related - archive of new
> and old Vietnamese literature, Vietnamese food cooking guides, etc...
> _Webmail Notifier Add-on. [stas: replaced by the AVIM add-on as per comment 12]

Awesome suggestions.

> 3. The 'Play' category:
> Clip.vn (http://www.clip.vn/) - YouTube of Vietnam.
> Zing MP3 (http://mp3.zing.vn/) - most favorite music site.
> SànNhạc (http://www.sannhac.com/) - a web-based karaoke site. Yeah, just like
> Japan, karaoke is the most favorite entertainment in Vietnam, even the old
> people like it! On this site, the top 2nd most active member is a middle-age
> man.
> _Easy DragToGo Add-on

Awesome suggestions.

> 
> 4. The 'Connect' category:
> Facebook (http://www.facebook.com/) - now available in Vietnamese!
> Thổ Địa (http://www.thodia.vn) - Yelp of Vietnam. It's quite interesting
> because "Thổ Địa" means "The God of Land (Ground/Soil)" who knows about
> everything happens on the land of a region.
> TruongTon (http://truongton.net/) - the most popular forum in Vietnam.
> Nhạc Cổ Điển (http://www.nhaccodien.info) - where people share their emotion
> about classical music, we will also host the blog of the Firefox localization
> team there.
> _Tab Mix Plus Add-on.

Yet again, awesome suggestions! :) Plus I really like the name "Thổ Địa" -- it would make a good title for a blog post :)

> 
> By the way, the GT template file in this bug is a bit different from the
> template in bug 463447. Which should I choose to translate?

I think the template in bug 463447 is better. Pascal?
yes, use the template un bug 463447, more generally, we do not follow en-US files but en-GB because there are frequent changes in en-US made by the marketing team for experimentation purposes.
I think we may consider some culture-related factors here. As you may not know, Vietnamese culture is quite different. Vietnamese people are kind of easily influenced by the society and the press. Rarely anyone wants to be so unique, they'd like to be a part of the society instead. People care about what others think about them. The relationship between someone and their family/friends are tight. They are also quite faithful and don't want to change things so frequently. And however good it is, if something is not mentioned by the press or experts/friends who people believe in, it will have a little chance to attract the attention of them.[1] I'm telling this to explain these things below:

1. Uhm, in facts, the site I would drop from the list without hesitation is RTM:
a) Most important, I don't see any article on popular newspapers/magazines featuring RTM. You can also try googling "Rememberthemilk" in Vietnamese, there are only 8 result pages. I also tried to contact those ones who had joined the localization of RTM, and well... no one answered me, it seemed that they didn't use RTM anymore?!
b) There are many people still use the old way: type the tasks in an email, then save it as a draft or email it to themselves. And in facts, instead of RTM, people use Google Notebook/Docs.  

2. And now, talking about Google and Yahoo:
a) Both are very, very popular here. They are mentioned everywhere, in every kinds of newspapers/magazines/media... So even people who know nothing about computer, or children could tell you that "you should search with Google, send IMs with Y!Messenger, and send emails with Y!Mail/Gmail".

So, if you think we should choose Google Docs for its popularity, then we'll have to replace some other sites with Google and Yahoo services as well, such as: Facebook -> Y!360, Clip.vn -> Youtube, Y!Answers in "Learn". (Especially Y!360, though it is not supported by Yahoo anymore and has so many bugs, it is still the most popular blog service since all people connections are here.)

And then, the Central page will just be full of Yahoo and Google! That's why I'm trying to suggest better sites (Facebook) and/or Vietnamese sites (Clip.vn), and of course, these sites should be well-known enough (not like RTM).

b) And yeah, in this era, I think if someone is completely new to the Web, they may not know about computer either. Since there are many Internet cafe in Vietnam, someone who has a computer without Internet connection will be able to access the Web there. And in facts, people who don't have computers still come to those Internet café to access the Internet.

So, if there is really someone who is completely new to the Web and doesn't know about computer, and even if they know about GDocs, I wonder whether they would try GDocs right away? From what I have seen so far, those "new users" will try to get to news sites, create an email account or download YM, find information, get to online games sites... but not work-related sites.

3. About vi.mozdev and Ubuntu-VN: 
Ubuntu-VN is the best place for talking about OSS at this time. One of the reason is because Ubuntu is the only Unix-based OS attracts the attention of the press. Moreover, the Ubuntu-VN team are requesting to become a LocoTeam, just like we're trying to become a Vietnamese team for Firefox, so we share many things in common. I had some talks with them, and we agreed to integrate Mozilla-VN user forums into the Ubuntu-VN forums.

I'm not trying to include vi.mozdev.org because it is our team page, but because there hasn't been any site dedicated to Mozilla in Vietnamese. At least I think we can do things better than the Irish project site (which is in English only and makes me wonder if it's really helpful to the local people?!). Our initial intention is to post basic tutorials for Vietnamese Firefox users and guide them to use the most out of it. (There are some people have used Firefox for months but they don't know about add-ons. And yes, the reason is they're using an English version)

In facts, what I really want is Mozilla, just like Google, will have the ability to detect the geolocation of the visitors in order to auto-display the right language. Though popular newspapers feature Firefox quite much, they just tell people to get to Mozilla.com to download it, and as the site is default in English, people will close the window right after they have finished downloading. So, if the information is auto-displayed in their language, they will be likely to stay and try navigating other sections of the site, which may lead them to the Support section (which will have Vietnamese soon) And then, we may not necessarily have vi.mozdev.org

And erm, of course, both sites are not originally suitable to the "Work" category. We are just trying to do what the Irish team do - promoting the Open Source spirit, just like Mozilla promoting CC.

4. Cyvee and Vietnamworks:
I once suggested Vietnamworks as a search plugin for Firefox Vietnamese version. However, after reading Minh's comment #9 on bug 463441, I think he was right. Being used to their workplace and having friends there, will anyone really want to search for jobs everyday, whenever they open Firefox? I've just noticed that the site is also an affiliate of VNExpress[2], and I wonder if VNExpress helped them to raise their Alexa rank. And about Cyvee, most of its members are office staffs who have good knowledge of English, and they usually have profiles on LinkedIn.

In general, you wonder whether DDTH is interesting to users who are not tech-savvy, then I also wonder whether these two sites are that great. However, they are suitable to "Work" category, and they are also from two competitor companies. (Vietnamworks' company has just released another "LinkedIn of Vietnam" at Caravat.com). So, it would be fair to include both sites.



5. Finally, I would suggest:
* vi.mozdev.org
* Ubuntu-VN
* Vietnamworks
* Cyvee
_Adblock Plus -> Webmail Notifier

I think I have stated all the necessary points. So if you don't think these suggestions are ok, just please suggest your final list, then we'll choose yours.

Thank you for taking your time :)

[1]: http://www.vietnam-beauty.com/vietnamese-culture/vietnam-culture-value.html
[2]: http://vieclam.vnexpress.net
Ping?
Axel has announced the FF 3.1b3 OPT-IN today, so may we get this bug fixed soon? (And there are only two bugs left for Vietnamese).
Hi Hung. We had a code freeze for 3.0.6 yesterday so I had to focus on that. I'll get back to this bug by the end of the week.
Just a quick comment: Ubuntu-VN is going to be a LocoTeam very soon. Canonical has just granted ubuntu-vn.org to them.
In addition to the Getting Started page, is there interest in a localized download page as we have for a number of other locales?  

http://af.www.mozilla.com/af/

I am hoping there is interest to do this for vi?  If so can that be added to this bug or is it a new bug?
Gen: yes, definitely. This page has not been created yet, because currently we don't even have a Vietnamese beta localization (planned for 3.1 beta3), so we cannot offer any download just yet. 

Pascal is in charge of that and we will manage it in another bug which will block bug 457928 (correct?). Pascal, do you think we could file a bug on this now to have the translation ready when the beta3 is released?

Also, note that this relates nicely to what Hung wrote in comment 20:

(In reply to comment #20)

> In facts, what I really want is Mozilla, just like Google, will have the
> ability to detect the geolocation of the visitors in order to auto-display the
> right language. Though popular newspapers feature Firefox quite much, they just
> tell people to get to Mozilla.com to download it, and as the site is default in
> English, people will close the window right after they have finished
> downloading. So, if the information is auto-displayed in their language, they
> will be likely to stay and try navigating other sections of the site, which may
> lead them to the Support section (which will have Vietnamese soon) And then, we
> may not necessarily have vi.mozdev.org

My hope is that we will have a localized landing and download page under mozilla/com/vi pretty soon, so this issue will be solved.
>In addition to the Getting Started page, is there interest in a localized
>download page as we have for a number of other locales?  

>http://af.www.mozilla.com/af/

The locales targetted are here:

http://l10n.mozilla.org/webdashboard/?project=4&task=Mozilla.com+landing+pages+for+locales

Vietnamese didn't seem to be ready for that when we launched the above project. Most of the l10n team will be at Fosdem this week end, so I'll check with them the status of Vietnamese product-wise before taking a decision on that.
(Oh, why didn't I receive any notification emails for the comments after my last one?!)

The web parts in bug 463447 were translated, but that bug is still blocked by this one. I don't get it: Why should we have to wait until there is a Vietnamese version of Firefox 3.1b3? Shouldn't we translate the pages first in order to be ready for the releases? If necessary, we can do the localization of Fx 3.0 right now, so you can have "a download to offer" :)

I'm ready at the moment. Just notice me when those pages are available for Vietnamese, I'll get my hands on translating right away.
The pages for 3.1 are not ready yet for translation, the getting started page will not change for 3.1 so it is effectively blocking both 3.0 and 3.1 releases.

The marketing team is updating the web parts for 3.1 to present new features and update the messaging for Firefox.
https://vi.www-trunk.stage.mozilla.com/vi/firefox/central/ is online, are the discussions in the comments above change the page? If so please provide an updated file with the relevant site icons, thanks.
I just looked at the page in SVN, and the Wikipedia link goes to the multilingual portal <http://www.wikipedia.org/>. Is it policy to always use the portal, or can we substitute a direct link to the Vietnamese Wikipedia <http://vi.wikipedia.org/>?
On closer inspection, it looks like the committed Vietnamese version just uses the same sites as the English version. Below are the links agreed upon, based on comment #9, comment #11, comment #12, and comment #20 (hopefully I haven't left anything out):

> Productivity and open source

Mozilla Việt Nam <http://vi.mozdev.org/>
Ubuntu Việt Nam <http://www.ubuntu-vn.com/>
Vietnamworks <http://www.vietnamworks.com.vn/>
CyVee <http://www.cyvee.com/>
_Webmail Notifier add-on

> Learn

Wikipedia <http://vi.wikipedia.org/>
Viet-Studies <http://www.viet-studies.info/>
DoanhNghiep24g <http://www.doanhnghiep24g.vn/>
Việt Nam Thư Quán <http://vnthuquan.net/>
_AVIM add-on

> Play

Clip.vn <http://www.clip.vn/>
Zing MP3 <http://mp3.zing.vn/>
SànNhạc <http://www.sannhac.com/>
_Easy DragToGo add-on

> Connect

Facebook <http://vi-vn.facebook.com/>
Thổ Địa <http://www.thodia.vn/>
TruongTon <http://truongton.net/>
Nhạc Cổ Điển <http://www.nhaccodien.info/>
_Tab Mix Plus add-on

Hùng, I suppose these customizations will go in Bug 463447, right?
Updated in r26272. I'm still waiting for some sites to send their logos, will attach them later. Should we create the logos for the addons?
(In reply to comment #32)
> Updated in r26272. I'm still waiting for some sites to send their logos, will
> attach them later. Should we create the logos for the addons?

Have you heard from any of the sites?  

Logos for the addons should be used from the AMO site.  Please make the logos and attach them for review.
I created logos for all the sites except 3 that didn't have logos. Same for addons. I also fixed a bad link to an add-on:

https://vi.www-trunk.stage.mozilla.com/vi/firefox/central/#feature-work

marking fixed
Status: NEW → RESOLVED
Closed: 15 years ago
Resolution: --- → FIXED
Oh, should we close this bug that soon? I thought we would still have time until the final release of FF 3.5.

Sorry Pascal for wasting your efforts :( , but please use these logos. They're official logos sent to me from the website owners. (Except Cyvee and TruongTon - they didn't reply me, so should we need to remove links to those sites?)

The GS page has just been updated in r27551. Thanks for all your help!
(In reply to comment #36)
> (Except Cyvee and TruongTon
> - they didn't reply me, so should we need to remove links to those sites?)

Yes, we should remove them for the time being. We should not add any websites to the page that we have not gotten confirmation/approval from.  We can add them later if they reply later.
> Yes, we should remove them for the time being. We should not add any websites to the page that we have not gotten confirmation/approval from.  We can add them later if they reply later.

Sorry Gen but this is not our policy. Freely linking to sites is the very basis of the open web, without this the web would not exist. If some site ask us to remove a link to their page we will do it out of courtesy of course, but setting this as a policy 

>Oh, should we close this bug that soon? I thought we would still have time until the final release of FF 3.5.

Do you have more changes to apply or sites to change? All en-US links have already been replaced by local equivalents. The selection of sites for this page is a release blocker bug for Firefox 3.5 in Vietnamese and QA of localized pages has started, so counting on Firefox being shipped late looks a bit risky to me :).

Note that marking this bug as fixed does not prevent updating the page later on with a separate bug to change a link and furthermore, updating text for rewording or typos can be done in a separate, non-blocker bug if needed.

I am reopening this bug in case as per your comment #36 in case you meant that you wanted to propose other sites for the page, if not, let's close this bug.


Thanks
Status: RESOLVED → REOPENED
Resolution: FIXED → ---
(In reply to comment #38)
> Do you have more changes to apply or sites to change? 
Well, in facts, I'm waiting for new Viet-Studies logo (the website owner also admitted that it's ugly :) And I've just sent emails to 2 other candidates for TruongTon - Gamevn.com (biggest site for gamers) and Acc.vn (biggest site for anime and manga fans). We'll pick the one who sends their approval first. So, may we wait until weekend?


> and QA of localized
> pages has started, so counting on Firefox being shipped late looks a bit risky
> to me :).
This is what I also want to know. Where could I track all those QA, release dates...? When is the deadline for those website bugs and what is the reasonable time for me to fix them? 

>If some site ask us to remove a link to their page we will do it out of ourtesy of course, but setting this as a policy 
Ah, regarding this, Vietnamworks got a question: in case of my inactivity, who in Mozilla they would contact to update info about their site if neccessary?
(In reply to comment #39)
> (In reply to comment #38)
> > Do you have more changes to apply or sites to change? 
> Well, in facts, I'm waiting for new Viet-Studies logo (the website owner also
> admitted that it's ugly :) And I've just sent emails to 2 other candidates for
> TruongTon - Gamevn.com (biggest site for gamers) and Acc.vn (biggest site for
> anime and manga fans). We'll pick the one who sends their approval first. So,
> may we wait until weekend? no 

sure :)

> 
> 
> > and QA of localized
> > pages has started, so counting on Firefox being shipped late looks a bit risky
> > to me :).
> This is what I also want to know. Where could I track all those QA, release
> dates...? When is the deadline for those website bugs and what is the
> reasonable time for me to fix them? 

A good starting point is this page:
https://wiki.mozilla.org/Releases/

We need the localized pages to be done 3 weeks before the release to do the QA and to have enough time to ask for changes on pages if QA finds problems.

> 
> >If some site ask us to remove a link to their page we will do it out of ourtesy of course, but setting this as a policy 
> Ah, regarding this, Vietnamworks got a question: in case of my inactivity, who
> in Mozilla they would contact to update info about their site if neccessary?

They can contact Stas or me.
Another think, in the logos you provided, the mozdev one is likely to be a problem, it is a modified firefox logo and we have a policy of asking people not to modify it, so having a modified firefox logo on a mozilla.com page is not consistent with our trademark policy. Can you provide a different logo or we can use the mozdev one I made.
(In reply to comment #40)
> A good starting point is this page:
> https://wiki.mozilla.org/Releases/
> 
I'm confused, FF 3.5 *final* version is not mentioned there, and even the RC1 doesn't have an exact release date?


(In reply to comment #41)
> Another think, in the logos you provided, the mozdev one is likely to be a
> problem, it is a modified firefox logo and we have a policy of asking people
> not to modify it, so having a modified firefox logo on a mozilla.com page is
> not consistent with our trademark policy. Can you provide a different logo or
> we can use the mozdev one I made.
Please, may we keep the modified logo like the Irish team keep theirs? We aren't good at creating logo, so a contributor from Ubuntu-VN offered his help... We don't want to make his effort wasted... And moreover, we might be considered as the official vi localization team for Firefox and Thunderbird, so I think that wouldn't hurt Mozilla? :)
http://ga-ie.www.mozilla.com/ga-IE/firefox/central/#feature-work
>I'm confused, FF 3.5 *final* version is not mentioned there, and even the RC1
doesn't have an exact release date?

Because we don't know yet when it is released, best guess is 2 to 4 weeks from now.

Stas, seth, your opinion about the logo?
(In reply to comment #43)
> Stas, seth, your opinion about the logo?

I am not in favor of using anything that modifies the official trademark/logo of Firefox.  We're going to have to be a bit dogmatic about this and say no.  Please try to submit the next best option. 

Sorry to be so strict, but we have to abide by the regulations set in place by our legal team with respect to our trademark policy.  I hope you can understand.
For information, the logo for ga-IE is now updated to follow our logo policy.
Oh, sorry to hear that. Sorry for the Irish team, too. Ok, I'll use the official Firefox logo then. Do we have an existing 110x65 version of it?
I put the Firefox logo online
Attached file New logo — 
New logo
Thanks, Pascal. I also have good news for you:

Viet-Studies owner is really busy at this time, and he didn't got any new idea for the logo. So, it should be fine to keep the current logo (well, however ugly it is, the current logo has been used on the site since it was founded :) He'll send us a new logo whenever possible. 

Gamevn and Acc didn't reply my emails. But luckily, a friend of mine pointed me to VnSharing.net - an even better substitute for Acc. Their Alexa rank is #134, much higher than Acc, and the site is well-organized (they were very active, answered and sent me their logo in just two hours).

About the addons, as AMO has recently introduced a brand new feature - Addon Collections - I think it would be great if we could let our users aware of that! The central page has been updated to point to a collection maintained by us. Just one thing left: could you please help us create a 110x65 version of the official Addon Collections logo[1], Pascal?

So, all new changes have been committed in r27761. I think it's fine to close this bug now.
Thank you, everyone :)

[1]: https://addons.mozilla.org/img/amo2009/illustrations/logo-collections-100x125.png
Both images are now published, marking this bug fixed, thanks!
Status: REOPENED → RESOLVED
Closed: 15 years ago → 15 years ago
Resolution: --- → FIXED
I've just made a minor change, updated in r28445.
You need to log in before you can comment on or make changes to this bug.

Attachment

General

Creator:
Created:
Updated:
Size: