1153465 - Thumbs-up confirmation image not locale-neutral?

Status: RESOLVED WONTFIX

(Firefox OS Graveyard :: Gaia::First Time Experience, defect)

Description

[Sam Foster [:sfoster] (he/him)]

Attachment: ftu-tutorial-complete.png

Is the 'thumbs up' image we use in the tutorial and completion of First Time Experience locale-neutral and appropriate in all markets? I was under the impression this is an offensive gesture in many parts of the world. 

Is there a bug to fix here, or is this image already replaced when partners ship the product in these markets?

Comment 1

[Sam Foster [:sfoster] (he/him)]

Was this already discussed, Stephanie? Have partners expressed concern or do they just replace the image. Or is it a non-issue these days.

Comment 2

[Stephany Wilkes]

I'm not a localization expert so I'm flagging Delphine on this. No one has said anything to me about it and I know Facebook uses it worldwide so...

Comment 3

[Delphine Lebédel [:delphine - Use needinfo]]

I'm sorry but I wouldn't be the right person to answer this :) I don't really know who would, TBH. 

However some quick initial research shows that, yes, it is offensive in some cultures: https://web.archive.org/web/20150330103826/http://www.huffingtonpost.com/gayle-cotton/cross-cultural-gestures_b_3437653.html
"The thumbs-up gesture is commonly used in many cultures to signify a job well done. However, if it is used in Australia, Greece, or the Middle East -- especially if it is thrust up as a typical hitchhiking gesture would be -- it means essentially "Up yours!" or "Sit on this!" The thumbs up gesture can also create some real problems for those who count on their fingers. In Germany and Hungary, the upright thumb is used to represent the number 1; however, it represents the number 5 in Japan. Take heed all you global negotiators: there is a big difference between 1 and 5 million!"

An idea would be to ni the community or localizers who live in this country, but short answer seems to be "yes, this is offensive" :)

Comment 4

[Delphine Lebédel [:delphine - Use needinfo]]

Talking with Gary, one idea would be to contact or ni the community/localizers for the markets targeted and ask them what they think.

Comment 5

[Sam Foster [:sfoster] (he/him)]

Zibi, can you help us find the right people to ask this question of?

Comment 6

[Francesco Lodolo [:flod]]

One first step is to CC the :l10n alias, we can also send out an email to dev-l10n to confirm if the image is offensive if we don't get any answer here.

Facebook ditched its thumbs up icon, not sure if only for design reasons or also cultural ones
http://www.fastcodesign.com/3021307/innovation-by-design/why-facebooks-new-like-button-had-to-ditch-the-thumbs-up

Comment 7

[Sam Foster [:sfoster] (he/him)]

Adding l10n alias for community feedback on this.

Comment 8

[Delphine Lebédel [:delphine - Use needinfo]]

Also, posted on our dev.l10n mailing list to gather feedback: https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/mozilla.dev.l10n/FNgVqaj3JmQ

Comment 9

[Peiying Mo [:CocoMo]]

There is a reason that there is no universal sign language.

Comment 10

[chris hofmann]

Interesting to note that in India it might have the opposite meaning of ok 
where some interpret thumbs up wagging side to side to mean disagree
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thumbs_signal#International_usage

Comment 11

[Delphine Lebédel [:delphine - Use needinfo]]

Adding a comment that Ahmed Nefzaoui left on my facebook about this, who is from the Arabic community: "In my personal opinion it is locale-neutral enough for facebook to use it as key element, still, that's how I personally see it. Concerning ME, I've never heard that it's an offending sign there (I see my mideastern friends share photos with that big like button in it, which is initially a thumbs up)."

Comment 12

[Delphine Lebédel [:delphine - Use needinfo]]

* From our Czech localizer, on dev.l10n: "Czech the thumbs up means "OK" or "GOOD" or "You're number 1". And AFAIK
it's the same in the whole central Europe. If it's offensive in other
countries (I think I heard about it, but do not have any personal
experience), why not to use a tick (check mark, not the arachnid...)? Or a
smile? I know it's everywhere, but never heard about any bad meaning in
different cultures. "

* From our Greek localizer, on dev.l10n: "Despite the fact that wikipedia says that it is offensive gesture in
Greece, people use it with the meaning that everything is ok or good.
I have used this gesture in Greece and I haven't any problem.
Maybe unofficially and under a very specific context (a discussion among
a group of friends) could be used in offensive way. But it isn't in
general and more specifically in the way we use it in FxOS screen. "

Comment 13

[Sam Foster [:sfoster] (he/him)]

I think we're agreed this is a non-issue. Notwithstanding http://www.fastcodesign.com/3021307/innovation-by-design/why-facebooks-new-like-button-had-to-ditch-the-thumbs-up (in which facebook de-emphasizes the thumb, but for icon-design reasons, not cultural) Please reopen with details if you find this is a documented problem somewhere.