298765 - Discrepancy/difficulty in locating attributed font compared to Safari

Status: RESOLVED WORKSFORME

(Core Graveyard :: GFX: Mac, defect)

Description

[Wayne Woods]

Sorry if this is a dupe of something, but I can't decipher all the technobabble
about fonts in the bug list to work that out :)

I encountered a font that Mozilla won't use when it's defined by the code in the
page, but it will work in Safari, and will work if it's set as the default font.

Download and install the Avva_Shenouda font from the URL listed above (or just
download from http://mycopticchurch.com/coptic/fonts/Avva_Shenouda.ttf )

Navigate to the test case URL ( http://mycopticchurch.com/coptic/coptic.asp ).
Close to the bottom of the page is a grey box with the sentence: "If the Avva
Shenouda font was installed properly, then you should be able to see the text
below." Just underneath is a section of text that should be displayed in the
correct font. Underneath that is a graphic of what it should look like if it works.

In Safari, it renders correctly, in Firefox and Seamonkey it doesn't.

However the browsers obviously have the ability to display the font, because I
can set it as the default and it then renders entire pages that way. It's only
when it's a page-defined font that it fails.

The "Allow pages to choose their own fonts" box is checked. I'm using the latest
nightly trunk builds on OS X 10.4.1 . No extensions or themes.

Comment 1

[Boris Zbarsky [:bzbarsky]]

What's the actual name of the font?  Is it "Avva_Shenouda" or "Avva Shenouda"?

Comment 2

[Wayne Woods]

Sorry Boris, I was away when you posted your question here, and I forgot all about it later..

The font family name is Avva_Shenouda. The font's full name is "Avva_Shenouda Normal". Setting the face to "Avva_Shenouda" works in Safari, but not Firefox.

I've discovered that if you set the face in the page code to be "Avva_Shenouda Normal", then Firefox WILL use the font. However then it fails to be used by Safari. So it appears that Safari and Firefox are using different methods of finding system fonts. I would guess that Firefox was wrong, since you'd expect Apple's own browser to locate its own system fonts correctly, but stranger things have happened.

One curiosity... unlike most fonts, Avva_Shenouda doesn't have a type called "Regular", just one  called "Normal". I've identified a couple of other fonts that were installed natively with OS X that don't have a "Regular" type and also fail to render correctly when used by Firefox but do work in Safari. One is "Apple LiSung", which only has a "Light" type. Mirroring the above example, if you set the face to "Apple LiSung Light", then the font IS used by Firefox, but NOT by Safari. Note that the Apple LiSung font only changes the typeface very subtly (it's fainter), so it won't appear startlingly different when it is used.

Also note that there are a number of other system fonts that don't have a "Regular" type, but still do work in Firefox, so it seems to be more complex than just that.

I'll post a couple of test cases. For one, you'll still need to install that Avva_Shenouda font from the link above. For the other, you should just need the "Apple LiSung" font which should be installed with OS X, or at least be available on your system install discs.

Comment 3

[Wayne Woods]

Attachment: Demonstrates the font usage weirdness

Remember you need to install the Avva_Shenouda font ( http://mycopticchurch.com/coptic/fonts/Avva_Shenouda.ttf ) beforehand.

Compare how the text is rendered in Firefox and Safari.

Comment 4

[Wayne Woods]

Attachment: Another example using Apple LiSung font

Compare how this attachment is rendered in Firefox and Safari.

You need to have the "Apple LiSung" font installed on your computer. If it isn't already, it should hopefully be on your OS X installer discs.

Comment 5

[Simon Fraser [no longer active]]

Dup of bug 121540 and/or bug 246527 ?

Comment 6

[Smokey Ardisson (offline for a while; not following bugs - do not email)]

Without knowing the internals of the font matching mechanisms, this sounds to me like a Carbon/Cocoa font name issue (Gecko requires Carbon font names).  Apple LiSung definitely has different Carbon and Cocoa font names (see bug 175651 and the "missing" default fonts).  It looks like Avva_Shenouda has different names, too: Avva_Shenouda Normal and Avva_Shenouda.

Someone should slap Apple around about the differing font names, really, but you can work around this issue by setting your font tags to "Carbon Font Name, Cocoa Font Name" (or vice versa).

I think the "bug" as the situation now stands is an Apple bug for having the differing font names for some fonts depending on the API/toolkit calling them; perhaps the Cairo/ATSUI conversion will make us start using Cocoa font names and then we'll be using the same names as Safari?  Simon?

Comment 7

[Wayne Woods]

Fixed in recent builds. Presumably from the change to Cairo.

Comment 8

[csjoshi]

Without knowing the internals of the font matching mechanisms, this sounds to me like a Carbon/Cocoa font name issue (Gecko requires Carbon font names).  Apple LiSung definitely has different Carbon and Cocoa font names http://bestheadlightbulbs.net/sylvania-headlight-silverstar-vs-xtravision/
http://bestheadlightbulbs.net/led-headlight/ It looks like Avva_Shenouda has different names, too: Avva_Shenouda Normal and Avva_Shenouda. Someone should slap Apple around about the differing font names, really, but you can work around this issue by setting your font tags to "Carbon Font Name, Cocoa Font Name" (or vice versa).