352107 - "Check for new messages every XX minutes" only works once a startup or manual check has been done

Status: RESOLVED WORKSFORME

(Thunderbird :: Account Manager, defect)

Description

[Armin Fuerst]

User-Agent:       Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.8.0.6) Gecko/20060728 Firefox/1.5.0.6
Build Identifier: version 1.5.0.5 (20060719)

If I have multiple e-mail accouts configured (mixed pop/imap) and want the
main account to be checked on startup and the other accounts occasionally
during the day, I configured the main account with
 * Check for new messages at startup
AND
 * Check for new messages at startup

The other accounts only had
 * Check for new messages every 10 minutes 
active.

No passwords are saved in my configuration. Only the main account
is checked (the password is requested during startup), the other accounts
are never checked. I have to manually select the accounts to be checked
for new mails, even if I wait for hours.

Reproducible: Always

Steps to Reproduce:
1. Configure multiple e-mail accouts
2. Don't save any passwords (signon.rememberSignons is set to "false" in my 
   config)
3. Select one account with "Check for new messages at startup" and
   "Check for new messages every 10 minutes" selected
4. All other accounts have only "Check for new messages every 10 minutes"
   selected
(4a. Verify all account configurations)
5. Restart Thunderbird
6. Only the main account's password is checked
7. Send e-mails to all accounts from outside (for example: Webmail interface).
8. Wait until the new mail arrives at the main account.

Actual Results:  
Only the mail sent to the main account will be shown in TB.

Expected Results:  
After the first period of time, TB should query for the passwords of the
other accounts and check for new mails.

The main reason of this configuration is the random order of passwords being
checked during startup. I'm switching multiple TB configurations and always
typed the wrong passwords with the wrong accounts (I could set the same password
for all accounts, but this is a bad habbit). An alternative solution would be
to be able to order the accouts so I can define in which order the passwords
will be queried during startup.

Comment 1

[Mike Cowperthwaite]

The 'every XX minutes' check also starts working if you manually check the account once (which makes TB prompt for the password).  

I'm not sure if the periodic check works every XX minutes without a startup-check if the password is stored; I suspect that an initial check is required to start the clock.  I guess what you're asking for is to check XX minutes after startup, and prompt for a password if one isn't stored?  

Do you really want a password prompt popping up while you're in the middle of composing a message or reading news or working in some other app, or not even around the system (in which case the server will time out)?  This doesn't really sound like a good idea to me.

Comment 2

[Mike Cowperthwaite]

Incidentally, the "random order of passwords" is due to the order in which the servers respond to ask for a password.  The requests at startup go out all roughly at the same time; some servers reply a little quicker than others, and the first one to respond is the first one to request a password.  Also, each account's check for new mail is in a different thread, so there's no guaranteeing which order the outgoing requests occur in -- nor, IMO, should there be.  

It would be nice, tho, if the password-request dialogs were a little more obviously different from account to account -- at least, with the account name in large letters -- so that you don't have to focus so closely on tiny text to figure out which password you should type.

xref bug 338549 for a further deterioration of startup password collection.

Comment 3

[David :Bienvenu]

>Do you really want a password prompt popping up while you're in the middle of
>composing a message or reading news or working in some other app, or not even
>around the system (in which case the server will time out)?

Thx, Mike, this is exactly why we don't do this. If you want check for new mail to start, you have to either remember the password, check at startup, or manually check mail on that account.

Comment 4

[Armin Fuerst]

I understand all comments, but currently, there can be a configuration assuming
the less important accounts will checked but they aren't.
The minimum change should be to enable the timer-checkbox only when the
startup-checkbox is selected.
Comment 2: Do you actually *read* the contents of a password-box? I don't and
I doubt I would if the letters were bigger. Perhaps an account-dependent
background-color of the password-box would be noticed? Or an Icon?

Comment 5

[Mike Cowperthwaite]

(In reply to comment #4)
> Comment 2: Do you actually *read* the contents of a password-box? 

Yes, because otherwise I don't know which password to type in.

> Perhaps an account-dependent background-color of the password-box would be
> noticed? Or an Icon?
 
Those could be useful, but I'd prefer, say, 16-pt text, showing the name I've given to the account -- I use short names that are all distinguishable and unmistakeable.  Colors are insufficiently mnemonic; icons would only work for me if they had the logo of the service, which would then be not so useful for the service where I have two accounts.

Comment 6

[Armin Fuerst]

(In reply to comment #5)

>> Comment 2: Do you actually *read* the contents of a password-box? 
>
>Yes, because otherwise I don't know which password to type in.

I have mixed account-configurations (depending on the computer I am working
on) and not every configuration has multiple accounts. So I'm used to typing
in the passwort of the main account without reading and I assume I would read
the contents of additional password-box.

>> Perhaps an account-dependent background-color of the password-box would be
>> noticed? Or an Icon?
>
>Those could be useful, but I'd prefer, say, 16-pt text, showing the name I've
>given to the account -- I use short names that are all distinguishable and
>unmistakeable.  Colors are insufficiently mnemonic; icons would only work for
>me if they had the logo of the service, which would then be not so useful for
>the service where I have two accounts.

I have no problem with 16pt text, but I think this alone would not help me. 
Perhaps we could combine this? Colors are sufficient if you have some accounts 
but if you have more than about 5 accounts I agree. The problems with 2 accouts
of the same serviceicon can be solved with creative modifications of the
icon.
I guess the best solution is to have the choice between these 3 solutions
(all three have advantages and disadvantages) but perhaps somebody has 
additional ideas?

Comment 7

[Wayne Mery (:wsmwk)]

Armin, does this look like a dupe of bug 278227?

Comment 8

[Armin Fuerst]

(In reply to comment #7)
> Armin, does this look like a dupe of bug 278227?
> 

No, the difference to bug 278227 is the checkbox "Check for new messages at startup". In bug 278227 it is activated, in bug 352107 it is unchecked.

Comment 10

[Arc Bac]

At my configuration, even checking for mail manually doesn't help to get automatic checks after it. I've set this certain mailbox to 5 minutes (the other being the "local" box), and mail simply doesn't get fetched automatically. I use the DavMail Gateway with Pop3 to access an Exchange box, but I don't think this has to do with the general problem here. Besides, TB 3.0 is a great piece of software that I'm looking forward to.

Comment 11

[Thomas D. (:thomas8)]

Confirming for the summary (not sure about steps).

STR

1 have your pop3 account setup to check and download new messages every 10 mins (this seems to work fine, initially perhaps only after restarting, password exists and everything) - make sure the 10 min cycle has just gotten new mails
2 then send yourself a test mail
3 go Tools > Account settings > ... and change the setting for that account to "every 1 min"
4 wait for your mail to be fetched after one minute (don't close TB)

Actual
- nothing, not after one minute, and no automatical checks whatsoever until you restart or get msgs manually. I'm not sure if the 10mins cycle was still operating, I think not. I'm also not 100% sure if getting them manually fixed it. But that's not the point:

Expected
- the new setting "check every X mins" should take immediate effect and start counting from the time I changed the setting.
- i.e. 1 min after I set "check every 1 min", TB should get mail automatically without user intervention.

Comment 12

[Thomas D. (:thomas8)]

Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.9.1.6pre) Gecko/20091110 Shredder/3.0pre

Comment 13

[Michael A. Pasek]

Doing a little testing with an attempted fix for Bug Report 533083, it appears that the lack of a password prompt is due to the setting of "Automatically download new messages".  For example, if the STR in the Description included DISABLING "Automatically download new messages", then no prompt for password would occur for the main account at startup.

With my attempted fix for Bug Report 533083, if I leave "Automatically download new messages" disabled, I get no prompt at startup (Bug Report 529364).  If I manually check for messages, I _am_ prompted and messages are retrieved, but "Check for new messages every xx minutes"....doesn't.  (Biff DOES work with the attempted fix if "Automatically download new messages" is enabled).  This corresponds (roughly) to the observations in comment #10.  

I can also confirm the observations of comment #11, that preferences settings don't take effect immediately -- but that should be a separate bug report.  In my case, this is with the attempted fix for Bug Report 533083 (but I'm pretty sure it'd occur without it) and the following settings:
  1) "Check for new messages at startup"
  2) "Automatically download new messages"
  3) "Check for new messages every xx minutes" is NOT enabled.

At startup, I'm prompted for a password, and mail is checked.  If I then open the preferences and enable "Check for new messages every 10 minutes" and click "OK", after waiting for 10 minutes, no
check is made for new messages.  If I then manually check for new messages (Command-T), it checks
for new messages.  If I wait another 10 minutes, no periodic check occurs.  With these (changed) settings, if I quit and restart, I'm prompted for a password and mail is checked at startup, AND the periodic check occurs after 10 minutes.  
---
I'm still working on figuring out why "Automatically download new messages" has the effect it does on whether checks for new mail occur....

Comment 14

[Michael A. Pasek]

Correction to comment #13:
> [...] if I leave "Automatically download new messages" disabled, I get no prompt at startup (Bug 
> Report 529364).  If I manually check for messages, I _am_ prompted and messages are retrieved, 
> but "Check for new messages every xx minutes"....doesn't.

Actually, it does.  I _thought_ I'd enabled the setting, but on checking preferences, "Check for new messages every 10 minutes" was disabled.  After a manual check for messages, 'biff' DOES occur although, not after 10 minutes, as I'd expected (it happened after 3 minutes).  Apparently, biff was scheduled, but checks something other than "Check for mail every xx minutes" (and the presence of a password) to determine whether or not to actually perform it.

I'm still confused about the "Automatically download" setting....

Comment 15

[Wayne Mery (:wsmwk)]

Thomas does this still fail for you?

Comment 16

[TBZ]

I may be having this bug on 102.1.0 (64-bit) too. POP3 servers set to check for new messages at startup, check for new messages every 2 minutes, automatically download new messages, will randomly stop their checks until a manual check has been done.

Comment 17

[Thomas D. (:thomas8)]

(In reply to abuse from comment #16)

I may be having this bug on 102.1.0 (64-bit) too. POP3 servers set to check for new messages at startup, check for new messages every 2 minutes, automatically download new messages, will randomly stop their checks until a manual check has been done.

That's similar bug 1779306.

(In reply to Wayne Mery (:wsmwk) from comment #15)

Thomas does this still fail for you?

Tested on 102.1.2 (64-bit), Win10.

It works for POP.
IMAP seems to work, too, but oddly not updating activity manager.

• Activity manager shows only first attempt (instantly in spite of Check for new messages at startup disabled), thereafter nothing.
• IMAP:4,timestamp logging does seem to show regular Get messages at chosen interval (1 min), assuming that the line having 127 FETCH (UID 198 FLAGS (NonJunk \Seen) is the one for Get messages.

So I think this bug as reported is wfm (but maybe someone could verify the IMAP log stuff?).

However, my comment 11 still applies: changing the interval fails to take effect for the current session and requires a restart without letting the user know (tested on POP) - I've filed this as bug 1784149.

Comment 18

[Dan Pernokis]

Parts of this bug sound suspiciously like an experience I've been having, in my attempts to avoid (or minimize) duplicate message downloading. I have been running TB 102.1.1 (32-bit) on Windows 7 and Norton Security AV, with several POP3 accounts configured (including their passwords).

Because dups were freely and randomly occurring, I de-selected both "check every nn minutes" and "include this account when getting new mail" -- for all accounts except one (which was a low-traffic account specific to the laptop just for shuttling messages in-house between computers). So I would have to manually poll an account to get its mail, but I could watch what came down. Sometimes there were dups (so I was immediately aware), but usually not.

However, once I had polled an account, it seemed it would sometimes -- not always -- continue being polled on its own. Unfortunately I never logged any of this at the time -- in my mind it was just another incident of dups coming down -- but at least it bolsters the opinion that something odd might be going on here with TB's use & interpretation of the settings.