Closed Bug 400867 Opened 17 years ago Closed 16 years ago

Inconsistencies in Serbian translations for Mozilla

Categories

(Mozilla Localizations :: sr / Serbian, defect)

Product:
Mozilla Localizations
Component:
sr / Serbian
Type:
defect
Priority:
Not set
Severity:
normal

Tracking

(Not tracked)

Status:
RESOLVED FIXED

People

(Reporter: filmil, Assigned: filmil)

References

Details

Here is the list of incosistences I have found (I think it is easier to file
them here than to make for each one a bug):

1. Page - "Strana" in most cases e.g. Save page as, but "Stranica" in "Page
setup"
2. Sidebar - "Bočni panel" in View menu, but "traka postrance" in history. The
second translation is wrong, though one can think of "Bočna traka" (later on
why).
3. Cut - "Ubaci" in Edit menu, but in context menu on search bar "Nalepi". I
prefer the first translation
4. Bookmark - "Omiljeno" as main menu item, but "Beleška" in Tools/Options. I
think that "Beleška" is much more in the spirit of Firefox/Mozilla as avoiding
"Favorites" is preferred.
5. Downloads - "Preuzimanja" in Tools menu, but "Prijemi" in Tools/Options.
First one is better.
6. Enable - "Omogući" almost everywhere, but "Uključi" at
Tools/Options/Enable Java
7. web site - "veb mesto" everywhere except "el. mesto" in Tools/Options and
Help and "sajt" in History sidebar/View, first one sounds OK
8. Upgrade - "Unapređenje" and "dogradnja", but both are not real thing...
"Aktuelizacija" is the best I can think of, I'll try to check Microsoft and
Ubuntu translation
9. Cancel - "Otkaži" everywhere, but "odustani" in Download manager
For items 3, 4, 5, 7, 8:  can you please explain why you have preferences?

Please note that the list above is by Ivan Icin, from BUG 377456.
3. It is like that in Ubuntu. Also it is more intuitive for me
4. I think it is explained it is just Favorites vs. Bookmarks
5. Most I know use this in everyday communication
7. this is also used I think in computer magazines and MS translation (but unsure exactly). But I haven't seen anyone use "el. mesta" and "sajt" is fine but it is just transcription
8. OOps, it is not Upgrade as I wrote, but Update, and that is exactly the reason why those two words have different meaning and all mentioned translations refer to the Upgrade
(In reply to comment #3)
> 3. It is like that in Ubuntu. Also it is more intuitive for me

Ivan, would it be OK to supply objective criteria.  I understand that it is like that in Ubuntu (might be, don't know) and that it is for you more intuitive.  However, I'd rather base a decision on arguments than on opinions.

> 4. I think it is explained it is just Favorites vs. Bookmarks
Ok, this seems to me a good point. 

> 5. Most I know use this in everyday communication

Something more concrete?

> 7. this is also used I think in computer magazines and MS translation (but
> unsure exactly). But I haven't seen anyone use "el. mesta" and "sajt" is fine
> but it is just transcription

Can you quote references for your claim at 7?  

"Sajt" (сајт) can be traced to an article in a linguistic magazine Језик данас (Language today), page 1, column 2: http://www.maticasrpska.org.yu/download/danas2122.pdf

> 8. OOps, it is not Upgrade as I wrote, but Update, and that is exactly the
> reason why those two words have different meaning and all mentioned
> translations refer to the Upgrade

Same as paragraph 1.

f


I am sorry, but language is based on conventions and not on arguments, so I can only provide you with conventions as I did and not with arguments as you ask.

E.G. If everyone called home page in Serbia home/"kuća" it should be translated like that, if everyone called it door/"vrata" it should be translated like that, and if everyone called it start/"početna strana" it should be translated like that, and it is done like that - wise choice.

Or could you provide me with argument why "Home page" is called like that on English?
(In reply to comment #5)
> I am sorry, but language is based on conventions and not on arguments, so I can
> only provide you with conventions as I did and not with arguments as you ask.
> [...]
> Or could you provide me with argument why "Home page" is called like that on
> English?

OK, no problem to elaborate what I meant.  

It seems to me there's no point here in explaining why some or other term is used.  I'd rather like to see a citation, showing that the term is used by someone who provably knows a lot about language or relevant technology. 

It is safe to assume that whoever knows a lot about the subject also has a good explanation for the decision.  Of course this method is not 100% error-proof, but it is in line with what people usually do: if in doubt, they ask the expert.  
So just point to the experts so I could ask them if need be.  For that matter, so can anyone else who sees this thread and is intrigued.

In contrast, if you say: out of two terms, A and B, I personally (or people I know) prefer B to A, this has little value for the rest of the world. That is, unless you are ready to explain why you have a preference.  It also helps if you can prove you know what you are talking about.  In case you are an expert, noone can determine if there really is a reason to prefer one over the other, unless you explain.  

Example. There is no need to provide you with an argument why "Home page" is called like that in English.  But I can give you many links where the label "Home page" is being used.  I can point you to many programs where the term "Home page" is used. etc.  For the term "вебсајт" or "сајт", I pointed to a linguistic periodical, issued by a reputable society (Матица српска), that used this term.

Hope this helps clarify things. 

Keep up the good work.  I will tend to your remarks ASAP.

7. Actual translation is "web lokacije" - try searching google for "web lokacije" site:.yu and you will find that this term is officialy used by Google and Microsoft.
(In reply to comment #0)
> 1. Page - "Strana" in most cases e.g. Save page as, but "Stranica" in "Page
> setup"
Corrected.
(In reply to comment #0)
> 2. Sidebar - "Bočni panel" in View menu, but "traka postrance" in history. The
> second translation is wrong, though one can think of "Bočna traka" (later on
> why).
Corrected.
Status: ASSIGNED → NEW
(In reply to comment #0)
> 3. Cut - "Ubaci" in Edit menu, but in context menu on search bar "Nalepi". I
> prefer the first translation
Corrected.  Using "Убаци" (Ubaci) throughout.
Status: NEW → ASSIGNED
(In reply to comment #0)
> 4. Bookmark - "Omiljeno" as main menu item, but "Beleška" in Tools/Options. I
> think that "Beleška" is much more in the spirit of Firefox/Mozilla as avoiding
> "Favorites" is preferred.
This will take some time, since the two translation flavors are numerous throughout the translation.

> 5. Downloads - "Preuzimanja" in Tools menu, but "Prijemi" in Tools/Options.
> First one is better.
See above.  "Prijemi" is shorter and just as much to the point as "Preuzimanja", so I'd opt for the former.


> 6. Enable - "Omogući" almost everywhere, but "Uključi" at
> Tools/Options/Enable Java
Corrected.

Rest are still pending.

> 8. Upgrade - "Unapređenje" and "dogradnja", but both are not real thing...
> "Aktuelizacija" is the best I can think of, I'll try to check Microsoft and
> Ubuntu translation
Microsoft uses word "Ažuriranje" - pretty similar to what I have proposed, but the less we invent the better. Ažuriranje.

> > 5. Downloads - "Preuzimanja" in Tools menu, but "Prijemi" in Tools/Options.
> > First one is better.
> See above.  "Prijemi" is shorter and just as much to the point as
> "Preuzimanja", so I'd opt for the former.
I am still after "Preuzimanja". While "Prijemi" might make some sense, in the verb form "Preuzmi" is OK, and "Primi" doesn't sound OK.

Also see this links:
http://www.google.com/search?q=preuzmi+site%3Amicrosoft.com&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a
http://sr.openoffice.org/preuzmi.html
Making this bug an umbrella for Serbian translation remarks
Depends on: 401468
No longer depends on: 401468
Depends on: 401468
(In reply to comment #11)
> (In reply to comment #0)
> > 4. Bookmark - "Omiljeno" as main menu item, but "Beleška" in Tools/Options. I
> > think that "Beleška" is much more in the spirit of Firefox/Mozilla as avoiding
> > "Favorites" is preferred.
> This will take some time, since the two translation flavors are numerous
> throughout the translation.
Corrected.
Just to add few things that need to be corrected in FF3b5 for Serbian language:

Menu Алати should be either Алат or Алатке. Word Алат already signifies plural.

In the menu Датотека, shortcuts for following items are not working and/or wrong:
Нови језичак — it states shortcut is Ctrl+ДОДАЈ У РЕЧНИК, should be Ctrl+T
Отвори адресу — similar problem
Сачувај страну као — same

Also in the menu Уреди, item „Изавери све“ has similar problem with shortcut.

Thanks for the remarks, corrected.
Status: ASSIGNED → RESOLVED
Closed: 16 years ago
Resolution: --- → FIXED
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