Open Bug 72798 Opened 23 years ago Updated 14 years ago

Fix ellipsis usage

Categories

(SeaMonkey :: UI Design, defect)

Product:
SeaMonkey
Component:
UI Design
Platform:
x86
All
Type:
defect
Priority:
Not set
Severity:
minor

Tracking

(Not tracked)

People

(Reporter: atontti, Assigned: atontti)

References

Details

Attachments

(3 files)

Adds ellipsis to properties menuitem and removes redundant cmd_rename
403 bytes, patch
Details | Diff | Splinter Review
same patch than the last one but now with diff -u
1023 bytes, patch
Details | Diff | Splinter Review
removes duplicate cmd_rename line
776 bytes, patch
Details | Diff | Splinter Review 
From Bugzilla Helper:
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux 2.4.0-0.43.12 i686; en-US; 0.8.1)
Gecko/20010320
BuildID:    2001032021

Steps to Reproduce:
1. Open Sidebar's Bookmark panel or Bookmark Manager
2. Open context menu for any bookmark

Ellipsis of properties menuitem are missing.

This has been shortly discussed at bug 68018.

I have fix in hand.
There are also duplicate cmd_rename lines so patch also removes the second one.
WFM on 2001-03-19 (i think after renaming or deleting some file).
WFM? Could you be more specific what do you mean with it?
r=bzbarsky@mit.edu

Asko, in general, could you generate diffs with the -u option?  They're much
easier to read.  Not to mention easier to apply.

Ben, could you a=?
Status: UNCONFIRMED → NEW
Ever confirmed: true
Keywords: approval, patch
Summary: [FIX] ellipsis of properties are missing → [FIX] Ellipsis missing on "Properties" option in bookmark context menu
please don't do this. Properties is not supposed to have ellipsis just like you 
don't have ellipsis on new navigator, or new message.

r=timeless for just the duplicate rename removal
Whiteboard: DONTFIX
Okay, I had to think over what timeless said.

So in Mozilla world the ellipsis are used when immediate user interaction is
needed to conclude the operation not when "main" or independent windows open?

Did I get it right this time?
yes that is the correct meaning of ellipsis, and that is what we should be 
using for mozilla. [mozilla's ui is partially tied to windows which also uses 
that definition.] I can't guarantee that we get this right everytime, but i can 
try to prevent people from making the problem worse.

    
    

    
  
Now patch only removes the duplicate line.

But Mozilla uses those ellipsis non-uniformly. I have been thinking about
going through the directory tree to fix them to be uniform :)  That takes
some time so it will not happen at least before next weekend.

timeless, is that okay?
Whiteboard: DONTFIX

    
    

    
  
r=timeless for 28727

and a smile for the rest of the comments :-)
Assignee: ben → atontti
Component: Bookmarks → XP Apps: GUI Features
OS: Linux → All
Summary: [FIX] Ellipsis missing on "Properties" option in bookmark context menu → Fix Ellipsis usage

    
    

    
  
alecf: would you sr? atontti: do you need someone to commit your fix?

    
    

    
  
I don't have check in rights for trunk, so yes, I do.
Status: NEW → ASSIGNED

    
    

    
  
I'm not getting involved, mostly because I think properties does not demand
ellipses because it is not a verb. I don't see ellipses after any other use of
"Properties" except in GNOME, and I think it looks wierd.

let someone else sr=, removing myself from the CC

    
    

    
  
patch for remove duplicate cmd_rename line moved to bug 76042.



    
    

    
  
In Aqua HIG (Macworld draft, page 50) it specifically says that an ellipsis
should be used for a command that opens a setting window. Examples include
"Options...". ("Properties..." is called "Options..." in Mac speak). (IIRC,
Microsoft doesn't use an ellipsis after "Properties", but in the past they have
followed Apple eventually. :-)

    
    

    
  
Page 43 i think: About Mail. No ellipsis, i'm sure about mail is a dialog.

MPT has complained about the current Aqua spec, and just because microsoft
occasionally follows apple's lead (and vice versa) doesn't mean much of 
anything.

Since Asko Tontti wisely split the rename portion out of this bug, i'm 
reassigning to the default owner.
Assignee: atontti → blakeross
Status: ASSIGNED → NEW
QA Contact: claudius → sairuh

    
  
Keywords: approval, 
          
            patch

    
    

    
  
The general rule, reprised from both Mac OS (Classic) and Windows UI guidelines 
(both of which I agree with in this case):

    Use an ellipsis if *the action which the item represents* requires
    further input in order to be carried out, once the control (e.g. the
    menu item or button) containing the relevant text is activated.

This doesn't mean opening a new window, though often that is the case. It's 
possible to open a new window without requiring further input for the command 
to be complete (e.g. `Help' > `About', or `File' > `New'). Conversely, it's 
possible for a menu item or button to require further input without opening a 
new window (though I can't think of any examples of that right now).

The final twist in the tail is that a confirmation alert does not count as 
`further input'.

Now, `Properties' tends to be the most difficult command to decide this for. 
You have to work out whether the most likely action is editing the properties 
(in which case further input is required, so you add an ellipsis), or viewing 
the properties (in which case no further input is required, so you don't have 
an ellipsis). If the `Properties' item is in the `Edit' menu or the `View' 
menu, it's easy; if it's in a context menu, things get more difficult.

If you want, post (or attach) a list of doubtful items here, including where 
they happen, and I'll say whether each one has an ellipsis and why.
Summary: Fix Ellipsis usage → Fix ellipsis usage

    
    

    
  
Bookmarks > "Add Current Page" should have ellipsis, since you get a dialog
before you add it.

Is this bug about all the menuitems that need (or need not) ellipsis in their label?

    
    

    
  
Matthew, thanks for you good comments that cleared the picture.

I promised to go through the tree so this bug is about all the UI labels
in the Mozilla.



    
    

    
  
actually, Bookmarks > "add current page" only has a dialog if the corresponding 
pref ("file without asking") is off.  If it's on, there is no dialog.  Should the 
presence and absense of "..." be controlled by the pref in this case as well?


    
    

    
  
That's a slight overkill of the usage, in my opinion. The ellipsis aren't *that*
important that we need to add special-casing code to add/remove them in certain
cases.

    
    

    
  
if we implemented add bookmark as two separate commands and used the pref to 
decide which command to wire to the menuitem, then you could go ahead and be 
correct for ellipsis there.  Otherwise just use ellipsis according to the 
default pref value.

    
    

    
  
Once bug 68654 is fixed, there will be `Add Bookmark' and `Add Bookmark As ...' 
as separate items, so that will not be an issue.

Anything else?

    
    

    
  
Why was this reassigned back to me?  I can't find anything in the bug about it.
Assignee: blakeross → atontti

    
    

    
  
See also bug #52978.
Depends on: 52978

    
    

    
  
Ok, here is a list of current dubious use of ellipsis:

In Preferences:
  Appearance|Languages & Content Packs|Download more (remove ellipsis 2x)
  Navigator|Helper Applications|Edit... (remove ellipsis)
  Navigator|Smart Browsing|More Information... (remove ellipsis)
  Mail & Newsgroups|Addressing|Edit Directories... (remove ellipsis)
  Privacy & Security|SSL|Edit Ciphers... (remove ellipsis)
  Privacy & Security|SSL|Edit Ciphers...|Details... (remove ellipsis)
  Privacy & Security|Certificates|Manage Certificates...
    (remove ellipsis, add elipse to Import, Backup and Backup All)
  Privacy & Security|Certificates|Manage Security Devices...
    (remove ellipsis, add elipse to Log In, Change Password and Load)
  Privacy & Security|Validation|Manage CRLs...
    (remove ellipsis, add ellipsis to Settings)
  Chatzilla|Startup|Edit...
    (remove this ellipsis and in the dialog itself the elipse in"Also connect to
the...")

In Mail & Newsgroups Account Settings:
  <Account Name>|Edit Card... (remove ellipsis)
  Composition & Addressing|Addressing|Edit Directories... (remove ellipsis)
  Outgoing Server|Advanced|Edit... (remove ellipsis)

In MailNews:
  File|Open File (add ellipsis)
  File|Save As|File (add ellipsis)
  File|Offline|Offline Settings (add ellipsis, already covered by bug 75622)
  Edit|(Folder|Newsgroup) Properties... (hmm, not sure about this)

In Composer:
  Insert|Table of Contents... (remove ellipsis)
  Insert|Table of Contents...|Insert (add ellipsis)
  Format|Positioning Grid (add ellipsis)
Product: Core → Mozilla Application Suite

    
    

    
  
As of 20080107 Firefox trunk nightly, here is a list, probably incomplete as I don't have access to a Mac:
Main window:File menu
   Page Setup... sounds fishy. I'm not sure if this needs an ellipsis or not.
Main window:View menu
   Toolbars > Customize... shouldn't have an ellipsis
   Character Encoding > Customize List... shouldn't have an ellipsis
Main window:History menu
   Show All History... shouldn't have an ellipsis
Main window:Bookmarks
   Show All Bookmarks... shouldn't have an ellipsis
Main window:Tools menu
   Options... shouldn't have an ellipsis (Windows only)
Main window:Help menu
   Check for Updates... shouldn't have an ellipsis
Places Organizer window:Import and Backup menu
   Backup... should be written Back Up...
   Restore...> shouldn't have an ellipsis (it's a submenu for god's sake!)
Prefs window:Content pane
   Exceptions... shouldn't have an ellipsis
   Exceptions... shouldn't have an ellipsis
   Advanced... shouldn't have an ellipsis
   Advanced... shouldn't have an ellipsis
   Colors... shouldn't have an ellipsis
Prefs window:Privacy pane
   Exceptions... shouldn't have an ellipsis
   Show Cookies... shouldn't have an ellipsis
   Settings... shouldn't have an ellipsis
Prefs window:Security
   Exceptions... shouldn't have an ellipsis
   Exceptions... shouldn't have an ellipsis
   Show Passwords... shouldn't have an ellipsis
   Settings... shouldn't have an ellipsis
Prefs window:Advanced pane, Network tab
   Settings... shouldn't have an ellipsis

    
  
Component: XP Apps: GUI Features → UI Design

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