Closed Bug 143702 Opened 23 years ago Closed 23 years ago

Mac OS X: need to provide just a Mozilla.app directory (not a folder w/ app & files

Categories

(SeaMonkey :: Installer, defect)

Product:
SeaMonkey
Component:
Installer
Platform:
PowerPC
macOS
Type:
defect
Priority:
Not set
Severity:
normal

Tracking

(Not tracked)

Status:
VERIFIED WONTFIX

People

(Reporter: benc, Assigned: dveditz)

References

(Blocks 1 open bug)

Details

(did dupe check in Mac OS X and Installer) I've been using Mac OS X a lot lately (new iBook at home), and I have noticed that there the interface really promotes the use of "top level" applications (applications that appear immediately when you click on Applications (or select Applications from the Finder menu). Applications hidden in a folder (like Terminal.app, which is in Utilities) are harder to get to because the folder appears at the bottom and you have to open the folder. Also, Mac OS X still doesn't map return or enter to open, so in icon view, this is less convenient than it should be. So, our current "Mozilla folder" with "Mozilla.app" folder disk image is really undesirable and inconvenient. This sounds like a real nit, but if you use Mac OS X a lot and a launch a variety of apps, I think you know what I'm talking about. If not, then you just need to take my word for it. People are running in droves to use Mac OS X because it has a powerful slickness factor, and we need to keep our release for an OS in keeping with the local standard. What would really help our cause is to make Mozilla (and Netscape) be more conformant to Mac OS X (actually this is from NeXTstep) which is to have apps appear only as a single filesystem object (they are actually iconized folders). This would mean getting rid of, or somehow hiding the profile migration and profile manager files. That would allow us to present one "application" (iconized folder) in the installer, a single drag and drop into "Applications" that is what you click to run. (We probably also need more "make yourself at home" features, like auto dock checking/registering).
Do I have this right...? The files "Mozilla Profile Manager" and "Mozilla Profile Migration" be moved inside the Mozilla.app package/folder to create one clean package. Is this really an invalid bug since FizzillaMach is a single Mozilla.app package with no subfolder and by the time work starts on this bug, it would be a mute point? Personally I do agree that inside of the Mozilla folder is Mozilla.app.
QA Contact: bugzilla → ktrina
Yes, all parts of an app (including everything it depends on, like shell scripts, resource files, etc) belong in the .app directory. Installing should be simply dragging that .app directory where you want it (typically in the /Applications directory). Uninstalling should be simply dragging that .app directory to the trash.
Recommend WONTFIX. Mozilla is already an .app directory. The Profile Manager and Profile Migration files are "runtime arguments" files, and the user needs to have access to them. They can't be hidden inside the .app.
There should NEVER be a 'runtime arguement' to an OSX app (with the exception of opening files from a drag or Finder call, and the like). It should be a user preference or tool loaded from Mozilla, and should have a standard UI for use.
Putting those files inside the .app package would make them essentially undiscoverable for users. Since they are the only way to access the functionality they link to WONTFIX. And for folks that think that 'runtime arguments' are bad on the Mac, just wait 'til we go to a mach-o based build where you can really pass command line arguments like *nix and Windows :-)
Status: NEW → RESOLVED
Closed: 23 years ago
Resolution: --- → WONTFIX
Why couldn't there just be a Profile submenu under tools for Manager and Migration? I can see where you might have to do a quit after some of the functions, but why not make them really discoverable?
Did they miss the part where I said that there should be a GUI interface to start/enable those things? "And for folks that think that 'runtime arguments' are bad on the Mac, just wait 'til we go to a mach-o based build where you can really pass command line arguments like *nix and Windows :-)" I would like to introduce you to ProjectBuilder some day, which lets you supply all those spiffy runtime args for the compiler from a GUI. Which is where APPLICATION functionality belongs. Tools are a different story.
The "right" way to "fix" this would be to spin the profile manager off into its' own executable, as was done in the Communicator 4.x days. (Of course, I think all the various "tools"---MailNews, Chatzilla, etc.---belong in their own executable, but...)
Geez, try to be nicer than just closing WONTFIX w/o comment and look what happens. :-) The Profile Manager for 4.x was simply an app that launched 4.x and sent it an AppleEvent to open the Profile Manager UI which was built into 4.x. For Mozilla we decided to leverage the command line arguments that *nix and Windows provided. If we split the tools up, and I'm not saying that's a bad idea, we still have the issue of putting them all in a common folder. Or do you want each component to sit seperately in the Applications folder? That poses a problem in that there are many common shared pieces which would preclude us from doing a simple drag install in that scenario. You don't really want to see the Mozilla install process become like the IE 5.2 install process do you? :-) Before I get beat up on a Mozilla browser only install let me just say one word - Chimera.
No. Just put it all in one folder. Or hadn't you noticed how big HD's are these days? If some hardcore geek wants to free up a few meg, they can dig into the folder and delete whatever they want. Everything should be in one folder. It should be a simple drag install. There should be a GUI for users to launch whatever tools you think they might want to launch. It should be that simple.
This bug was about moving "Mozilla Profile Manager" and "Mozilla Profile Migration" into the Mozilla app bundle. That's WONTFIX. Making additional comments here is a waste of time. File a seperate bug as an RFE if you want to see the Mozilla monolithic app broken up into a suite (I'm pretty sure there already is one). Don't expect to get much support for your suggestion that every app can carry around their own seperate copies of runtime baggage. Despite the low cost and huge size of drives these days people still go through their apps removing unused languages to reduce their footprint. There's also the issue of keeping the subsystems in sync. Ideally we'd have a common library that all Mozilla apps, or any app wanting to use the Gecko layout engine and its support infrastructure, could use. That's actively being worked on. How you resolve that with wanting to have self contained downloads that aren't something a modem user would run screaming from and a simple drag install that Mac OS X users have come to expect are details to be worked out.
"Despite the low cost and huge size of drives these days people still go through their apps removing unused languages to reduce their footprint." Not really - just a few geeks. Most users don't care. They just want an easy install. "Making additional comments here is a waste of time." Only if nobody else points out that this is a bug and should be fixed. If they do, and it gets dupe'd here, they'll have a better understanding of what they're up against.
What part of the first paragraph in my last comment didn't you understand? No matter what comments you add to this bug it isn't going to change from WONTFIX. It wastes my time replying to your comments so I'll just remove myself from the list of people that receives e-mail about this bug. Feel free to make as many more comments as you'd like but I suggest you don't hold your breath waiting for the resolution to change. Logging a new RFE bug requesting a componetized Mozilla suite rather than a monolitic application, or voting on such a bug if it already exists, would be something useful you could do though.
The beauty of bugzilla is that it is a living document as to why things were (or were not) done. Future dupes will be able to read this and see what was discussed. "It wastes my time replying to your comments..." Nobody asked you to. "Logging a new RFE bug requesting a componetized Mozilla suite..." Seem to have lost track of this bug, which is to roll everything into the .app directory.
Verified wontfix Logged Bug 159447 | Requesting a componetized Mozilla suite rather than a monolitic application I didn't find a dupe but if anyone else can, please feel free to dupe it. Thanks!
Status: RESOLVED → VERIFIED
Product: Browser → Seamonkey
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