266299 - browser.link.open_newwindow.restriction should have a default value of 2

Status: RESOLVED FIXED

(Firefox :: Settings UI, defect)

Description

[Jim D]

User-Agent:       Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.7.3) Gecko/20041026 Firefox/1.0
Build Identifier: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.7.3) Gecko/20041026 Firefox/1.0

Options\Advanced\Tabbed Browsing
"Force links that open new windows to open in:"
This option badly needs an exception for javascript links, especially when "new
tab" is selected.

Example cases: online game sites like pogo.com and zone.msn.com that open a java
applet game in its own little window are forced to use a new tab in the main
window. This new tab is then resized by the applet, messing up all the other
tabs that are open.

Reproducible: Always
Steps to Reproduce:
1. Go to www.pogo.com
2. Make sure the Force links that open a new window to open in... is turned on
and that "a new tab" is selected.
3. Pick any game and enter a game room. Firefox will freak out.

Actual Results:  
Firefox resized itself to the game (Sweet Tooth in this case) according to the
applet's instructions, rendering the web pages open in other tabs nearly
unreadable until I resized the window again, correcting the other pages but
making the game look rather silly.

Expected Results:  
In this case, since the game is opened via a javascript link, it should open in
a new window.

Comment 1

[Jesse Ruderman]

A more consistent solution would be to stop the tab from resizing itself.  See
bug 186708.

Comment 2

[Craig]

I just noticed this bug in RC1. Clicking a link on a forum to open the Add
Smilies page opened in a new tab. Adding smilies therefore could not be done by
simply clicking - making that feature of the forums useless.

Has anyone mentioned a possible over-ride for of the force links that open new
windows to open in a new tab feature, by middle-clicking on the mouse (or user
customized)? We're used to middle-clicking to open a new tab in previous
versions, how about allowing middle-clicking to open a link in a new page? While
still keeping the open in a new tab feature.

Comment 3

[Gilles Durys]

This also causes a problem with bookmarklets that open a new window (such as
Jesse's JavaScript Shell)

Comment 4

[TGOS]

I have problems with that as well. On general, I always want to have new windows
as a tab (e.g. all links with target "_blank") and I don't mind that windows
opened by JS are handled that way as well (because many people use JS for things
like opening a new window and loading a new page in the current window when you
click a link). So in general, it's a good thing that all windows open in tabs.

However, very often webmasters use JS windows like dialogs. Small windows, that
show little content, nor URL bar, no toolbars, no status bar, and once you click
something there, it goes a way. Help windows or media player windows are example
for that. If these are opened in new tabs, it's highly annoying.

As a programmer, I don't see how to distinguish these little windows of the big
windows opened by JS, so the only reasonable solution to me is a way to limit
the force-option (regardless if new tab or same tab/window) to _blank target
links only, if user wishes so. Others may prefer to also have JS windows in a
new tab.

Comment 5

[Mike Connor [:mconnor]]

This is one of those "no right answer" bugs.  setting
browser.link.open_newwindow.restriction to 2 means that windows with specified
features/sizes will open in new windows.  That'll do what you're asking for.

Comment 6

[TGOS]

Okay, so Firefox can do what people request here. Okay, let's make this bug a
feature request. It is nice that Firefox has so many great features, but it's
useless if they are hidden somewhere between 250 other settings and nobody knows
they are there.

-> Needs GUI Preference

Either that or we should exclude JS Windows by default, because very little
people will ever want to have these in tabs, too.

Here are the three possible settings:

0 (default): Force all new windows opened by Javascript into tabs.

1: Let all windows opened by Javascript open in new windows. (Default behavior
in IE.)

2: Catch new windows opened by Javascript that do not have specific values set
(how large the window should be, whether it should have a status bar, etc.)

Right now 0 is default. That makes little sense. If you are against a GUI Pref,
make either 1 default (users are used to it) or even better, make 2 default (to
be better than IE).

Comment 7

[Mike Connor [:mconnor]]

actually, there's two prefs, one is whether/where to open these links, the other
is how to handle window.open.  Talking about an IE default for this pref is
irrelevant, since this isn't the pref you think it is.

2 was the original default, and we got enough feedback to change this before
1.0.  I don't think this needs UI, in fact I'm pretty sure no one would
understand the pref without a lot of text, and they know what they're looking
for.  That was the original rationale, and I haven't seen any feedback that
indicates that this is necessary to have UI for.

WONTFIX.

Comment 8

[TGOS]

-= First =-

Mike, the setting are exactly what I think they are. Have a look at:

http://kb.mozillazine.org/Firefox_:_FAQs_:_About:config_Entries

*** browser. link. open_newwindow:

Where to open links that would normally open in a new window
2 (default): In a new window
3: In a new tab
1 (or anything else): In the current window


*** browser. link. open_newwindow. restriction

0 (default): Force all new windows opened by Javascript into tabs.
1: Let all windows opened by Javascript open in new windows. (Default behavior
in IE.)
2: Catch new windows opened by Javascript that do not have specific values set
(how large the window should be, whether it should have a status bar, etc.)


I did understand the settings very well, no need to treat me as if I'm too
stupid to understand them. And it is not irrelevant to talk about IE here,
because (1) definitely *IS* the defalt behavior of IE. Okay, IE treats _blank
links the same way, but *THAT* is irrelevant when just looking at the
restriction setting.


-= Second =-

"No one would understand the pref without a lot of text" is maybe your opinion,
but far away from the truth.

[_] Force links that open new windows to open in:
    (_) the same tab/window as the link
    (_) a new tab

    [_] Exclude unblocked pop-up windows

Everybody knows what a pop-up window is (in fact it is a resized Javascript
window without status, title or toolbar; but people don't need to know that).
And "unblocked" is there, so people know that the option does not annul the
pop-up-blocker.

Could be that simple.


-= Third =-

You don't need a GUI option, just change the default.

"2 was the original default, and we got enough feedback to change this before 1.0."

Where is it? A bug number? A forum link? Any reference to that?

I can't imagine that anyone wants windows, that were designed right from the
start to only have a certain size and to appear as pop windows, to be *forced*
into tabs or the current window (the current window is deadly, because these
pop-ups are always helper windows, never intended to replace the current one and
tabs makes no sense either).

If you ask me, the people who really wants that are "geeks". Please don't take
that in a negative way, I don't want to insult anyone, but I think only Linux
hardcorde shell users would like a browser to behave like that. So why are we,
the normal users, forced to go to about:config and change a cryptographic
options, instead of choosing another default behavior and have the geeks go to
about:config, that pretty much cahnged every second option there themselves anyway?


Let's change the bug's summary and make it what the original poster really intended.

Comment 9

[Mike Connor [:mconnor]]

"Exclude unblocked popup windows" would be inaccurate, since if you unblocked a
site for popups, and they used window.open without features, it'd open in a tab.

Feedback wasn't just bugs, it was forum discussions, blogs, IRC.  I don't really
feel like digging up things from seven or eight months ago to prove a point. 
People who wanted this pref wanted to have a single window mode, and changing
the pref doesn't do that.

"IE's default behaviour" in that doc is misleading, since this pref only applies
when the open new windows pref is set to redirect.  So setting that pref to 1
doesn't mimic IE's default behaviour with windows.  Its not really accurate or
beneficial.

In any case, the prefs will stay as they are, and we're not adding more UI at
this point.  I don't really feel like carrying on a long discussion that won't
go anywhere, so I won't.

Comment 10

[Jim D]

(In reply to comment #9)

> In any case, the prefs will stay as they are, and we're not adding more UI at
> this point.  I don't really feel like carrying on a long discussion that won't
> go anywhere, so I won't.

How incredibly closed-minded. You sounds like a two-year-old putting his foot
down and hollering "NO!" There are quite obviously people who want the feature,
and as stated before there's really no point in having features in Firefox that
are so obscure and hidden that no one can use them.

Adding a checkbox won't hurt Firefox. Insane, flat-out overbearing rhetoric like
this will.

Comment 11

[Mike Connor [:mconnor]]

If there was a consensus decision made for a certain default, we're not going to
rehash and revisit that decision simply because people disagree.  People always
disagree.  I've gone through this process dozens of times, and in the end, maybe
10% of the time was it worth it.  I could spend hours or days debating the
merits of the decision, but ultimately, the decision is mine and a few others,
and nothing new has been brought to the table that wasn't part of the original
decision-making process, so the original decision stands.

Just because someone wants it doesn't make it right.  And everything we add to
the UI is another straw on the camel's back.  Maybe this wouldn't matter, on its
own, but that attitude has a fatal flaw in that anyone can argue it.  Death by a
thousand pinpricks is what we're trying to avoid, and if that means digging in
on pref requests, so be it.  Note that a couple cc's and a couple votes does not
a consensus make.

Comment 12

[TGOS]

> "Exclude unblocked popup windows" would be inaccurate,
> since if you unblocked a site for popups, and they
> used window.open without features, it'd open in a tab.

How many of these are there? Show me just one page on the WWW that opens a
window via JS on page load and does not apply any attributes to it. Just one. I
have never seen one and I'm surfing the WWW since the day of the earliest browsers.

For me, the current option is much more measleading. When I read "Force links",
I thought of links; but many of the pop-ups are not even links(!), just elemets
with onclick attribute. Often they don't even show a hand (sometimes an arrow
with question mark). And often they are buttons (form buttons) and these are no
links either. Still, the option applies to these. So which is more misleading?

> Feedback wasn't just bugs, it was forum discussions, blogs, IRC.

I have not seen it. Can you show me a forum discussion on Mozillazine? It is
hard for me to understand your point of view, if the only argument of you is
"There has been discussion, but I can't name you a single argument, nor can I
show you any of it". Great, very convincing.

For me it is so illogical, that I can't believe there is anyone who really wants
that, maybe except you and that's why you shmash it down.

> People who wanted this pref wanted to have a single window mode,
> and changing the pref doesn't do that.

Then Firefox should get a single window mode option; how does this relate to the
current option or the request of this bug? And I told you before, a real single
window mode does not work with pages using Javascript pop-ups. How would that
work? It can't! Think about it just for one second and use your God given
rational brain. It can not work!

We just want that _blank pages go into a new tab and JS pages not. We don't want
a single window mode. And this is not possible, unless you do some obscure hacks
hidden in the browser, because you feel that you must provide users with a
single user mode that would, if used, render 1/3 of all webpages useless.

> So setting that pref to 1 doesn't mimic IE's default
> behaviour with windows.

IE's default behavior is to open everything that should open in a new window in
a new window. This is true for _blank and this is true for everything opened
with Javascript and this is also what 1 does in Firefox. If the redirect option
is not set, as you said, this option does not apply, right, but then Firefox
shows IE behavior more than ever, regardless of the setting.

> In any case, the prefs will stay as they are, and
> we're not adding more UI at this point.

Nobody wants you to add more UI, see the summary of the bug!

More UI makes it more complicated. Keep it simple for simple users. And simple
users may want to open _blank links in a new tab instead of a new window.
However simple users will get very annoyed if they now want to see the smiley
help in their favorite forum and all of a sudden see nothing but the smileys in
a new tab and have to switch tabs to go forth and back between the help. And
simple users don't want to go to about:config, because they don't understand it,
they don't know what to change and what 1, 2 or 3 means! And if there is
something simple users don't care for, it's single window browsing that means
they can't use 1/3 of all pages in a useful manner any longer.

Comment 13

[Mike Connor [:mconnor]]

No means no.  Please read up on bugzilla etiquette/process before your editbugs
privs get revoked.

Comment 14

[Jesse Ruderman]

The WONTFIX decision was reversed in bug 313300.

Comment 15

[Worcester12345]

I'm not sure, but is this somehow related to https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=172962#c228

Comment 16

[Mike Connor [:mconnor]]

sorry for bugspam, long-overdue mass reassign of ancient QA contact bugs,
filter on "beltznerLovesGoats" to get rid of this mass change