I need to update this report a little bit ;-) 1. I moved my demonstration to a new IP: 184.108.40.206 2. The demonstration now downloads a copy of the installer for Notepad++ instead of calc.exe. 3. The code only runs without prompting when UAC is disabled. If UAC is enabled, the user is prompted to run an executable named JREInstallVERSION.exe (ie: JREInstall160_24.exe). 4. Oracle has told me that they aim to release a fixed version in the October Critical Patch Update for Java.
The October 2011 Critical Patch Update was released. That means the latest versions of Java 6 and Java 7 are no longer vulnerable (Java 7 was patched silently earlier in the year). I've written a little bit about the vulnerability on my blog: https://nealpoole.com/blog/2011/10/java-deployment-toolkit-plugin-does-not-validate-installer-executable/
Status: UNCONFIRMED → NEW
Ever confirmed: true
This has been sitting for a looong time, what's holding us up here?
Is a block necessary here? If so, which versions of the plugin should be blocked?
Assignee: morgamic → jorge
https://nealpoole.com/blog/2011/10/java-deployment-toolkit-plugin-does-not-validate-installer-executable/ "The Java Deployment Toolkit Plugin v220.127.116.11 and below for Firefox and Google Chrome can be used to download and run an improperly signed executable on a target’s system. UAC, if enabled, will prompt the user before running the executable. This vulnerability has been tested and confirmed to exist on Windows 7, both 32-bit and 64-bit. It was fixed in Java 7 and Java 6 Update 29. This issue has been assigned CVE-2011-3516."
Blocking this is tricky since we need to use regular expressions, per bug 558584 comment 16. Is there a listing of all version numbers that have been released? It's easier to just enumerate those vulnerable versions not covered in bug 558584.
Is this still a security concern?
Yes, people running the old versions are still at risk. We should just blocklist the Java Deployment Toolkit Plugin entirely (click to play) since it's not used to run Java applets (that's a separate Java Platform plugin) and is generally unnecessary.
Are we okay with blocking all versions of the Java Deployment Toolkit? It seems harmless enough to do this.
Anthony, we need the about:plugins info for the Java Deployment Toolkit in the 3 major platforms. Same as with the others, latest versions and a few old ones so I know what to use for the blocklist filters.
QA Contact: anthony.s.hughes
(In reply to Jorge Villalobos [:jorgev] from comment #10) > Anthony, we need the about:plugins info for the Java Deployment Toolkit in > the 3 major platforms. Same as with the others, latest versions and a few > old ones so I know what to use for the blocklist filters. Okay, this will take some time. How soon do you need this done by?
It's not urgent (this bug is pretty old). Within a couple of weeks is good for me, thanks.
(In reply to Jorge Villalobos [:jorgev] from comment #9) > Are we okay with blocking all versions of the Java Deployment Toolkit? It > seems harmless enough to do this. Sounds good to us, with QA verification.
Here is the info for the versions we were able to find: https://wiki.mozilla.org/QA/Plugins/About:Plugins#Oracle_Java_Development_Kit
Anthony: That doesn't look quite right. This bug is about the Java Deployment Toolkit (Java DT, http://www.java.com/en/download/faq/deployment_toolkit.xml), not the Java Development Kit (JDK). Java 7u25 yields the following Java Deployment Toolkit plugin info on Windows for me: Java Deployment Toolkit 18.104.22.168 File: npDeployJava1.dll Version: 10.25.2.16 State: Enabled NPRuntime Script Plug-in Library for Java(TM) Deploy
Sorry, I wasn't clear that was what you were looking for. I'll work on getting that information for you over the coming days.
Okay information is now available: https://wiki.mozilla.org/QA/Plugins/About:Plugins#Oracle_Java_Deployment_Toolkit Apologies again for the delay and confusion.
Block is staged now for all versions of this plugin. Please give it a quick test: https://addons-dev.allizom.org/firefox/blocked/p361
(In reply to Jorge Villalobos [:jorgev] from comment #18) > Block is staged now for all versions of this plugin. Please give it a quick > test: https://addons-dev.allizom.org/firefox/blocked/p361 What can we use to confirm the plug-in is being blocked? Is the STR and server in comment 0 still relevant and available?
(In reply to Anthony Hughes, Mozilla QA (:ashughes) from comment #19) > (In reply to Jorge Villalobos [:jorgev] from comment #18) > > Block is staged now for all versions of this plugin. Please give it a quick > > test: https://addons-dev.allizom.org/firefox/blocked/p361 > > What can we use to confirm the plug-in is being blocked? Is the STR and > server in comment 0 still relevant and available? Hmm, good point. I don't know if those are still valid. If we can't find some easy way to test this, I'll just move forward with the block.
Would you like me to set up a working proof of concept again?
We don't need an exploit PoC, just something that we can use to verify the block is working or not. If you can give us that, that would be most excellent :).
Thanks, I'll try to have this tested and signed off by tomorrow.
Does not appear to be working. I tested with Firefox 25.0a1 and JDT 22.214.171.124 (Java 7u25) on Windows XP. Before pinging the blocklist the test page displays "YES". After pinging the staged blocklist the test page still displays "YES". I see the following in my profile blocklist.xml following the ping to staging: > <pluginItem blockID="p361"> > <match name="filename" exp="npdeployJava1\.dll"/> > <versionRange severity="0" vulnerabilitystatus="2"/> > </pluginItem> Note about:plugins shows: > Path: C:\WINDOWS\system32\npDeployJava1.dll I'm not sure if the blocklisting mechanism is case sensitive but that might be why this is failing.
I just updated the staged block so that it supports the upper case and lower case D in the file name. Please try again.
Testing is now completed on staging with no issues found. Please push this live.
Status: NEW → RESOLVED
Last Resolved: 6 years ago
Resolution: --- → FIXED
Roger Lewis, is there an Oracle advisory for this bug now, and is it fixed in the latest Java version? Can we un-hide this bug?
Benjamin, The advisory is under CVE-2011-3516, found http://www.oracle.com/technetwork/topics/security/javacpuoct2011-443431.html which went out with the October 2011 release.
Whiteboard: [sg:vector-critical] → [sg:vector-critical] [CVE-2011-3516]
Hello, Team, JFYI 7u51 is here and I didn't found anything about it in the Oracle's allerts. Either somebody did? Just curious... Is that so nobody thinks about a two simple and clear things? 1. this "bug" looks, er... well, a bit ancient. 2. this big fat red warning and explanation page that points out to (1) constantly shames Oracle and moreover IS a shameless LIE.
(In reply to vitar from comment #32) > Hello, Team, > > JFYI 7u51 is here and I didn't found anything about it in the Oracle's > allerts. Either somebody did? > > Just curious... Is that so nobody thinks about a two simple and clear things? > 1. this "bug" looks, er... well, a bit ancient. > 2. this big fat red warning and explanation page that points out to (1) > constantly shames Oracle and moreover IS a shameless LIE. Hi, is there a reason to block an application if the status is resolved fixed? I have really trouble that I'm not able to use secure_auth with firefox because of this block. Thanks for an answer
(In reply to Martin Greulach from comment #33) Please open a new thread on support.mozilla.org and reference this bug report.
https://support.mozilla.org/questions/983583 What kind of support are we supposed to provide for this situation? No Click-to-Play prompt, no way to disable Click-to-Play, original issue may be long patched by now. What else is there to do but disable the entire blocklist and punch a giant security in Firefox for the sake of this one plug-in?
Please wait for a response from someone at Mozilla on that thread. I will not respond to further need-info requests on this bug.
(In reply to Gingerbread Man from comment #35) > https://support.mozilla.org/questions/983583 Sorry for reply here but I'm too lazy to register around every corner. Anyway glad been to heat Team's brains a bit :-) And sorry again but this "Chosen Solution" (it's the best up to now, isn't it) looks the same stupid^W strange as a wide-known MS Outlook "security" (unconditional blocking of attachments by extension) or even worse. AFAIR blocklisting been a versions/bulds based. Pity I was wrong.
Ok so what is it with this bug or whatever, just today I cant get into http://www.skyviewcafe.com/skyview.php,it used to give me the option to proceed at my own risk, now cant even do that.
After activating Java at http://www.skyviewcafe.com/skyview.php I see an "Application Blocked" dialog. This Java message has nothing to do with the Java Deployment Toolkit. See these Java Help pages: http://www.java.com/en/download/help/appsecuritydialogs.xml http://www.java.com/en/download/help/java_blocked.xml
Wow, thanks a lot for your fast reply, did what u suggested and it worked.
Please don't permanently block this. My children's Virtual Academy uses it for Blackboard Collaborate which launches their class connect sessions. Without it, we can't connect. Continue to allow the option to temporarily allow use. It is only needed long enough to get the application which opens the room running. Once the room opens, I can disable it without closing the room, but without it the classroom does not exist and they don't get to interact with their peers and teacher, nor can they access the recordings for sessions they missed. We need this, but only as optional!!!
It says resolved fixed, so why does it continue to get flagged???
(In reply to Ana from comment #41) > Please don't permanently block this. My children's Virtual Academy uses it (In reply to Ana from comment #42) > It says resolved fixed, so why does it continue to get flagged??? This plugin is blocked because there is a security thread. Blocking is the solution. The real work has to be done by Oracle. May be your Java version is outdated and needs to be updated. That's your job. See answer Comment #39: https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=636633#c39 "This Java message has nothing to do with the Java Deployment Toolkit. See these Java Help pages:" http://www.java.com/en/download/help/appsecuritydialogs.xml http://www.java.com/en/download/help/java_blocked.xml
Thank you so much for blocking this. Now I can't upload any pictures to my Weight Watchers website. You give me no alternativeS or choice. GOOD JOB! THANKS A LOT
(In reply to mkeawsh_2000 from comment #44) > Thank you so much for blocking this. Now I can't upload any pictures to my > Weight Watchers website. You give me no alternativeS or choice. > > GOOD JOB! THANKS A LOT Please familiarize yourself with our etiquette guidelines before posting any further comments in Bugzilla. Thank you. https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/page.cgi?id=etiquette.html
(In reply to forumkurt from comment #43) > This plugin is blocked because there is a security thread. Blocking is the solution. Any PC that's turned on and connnected to the Net are vulnerable by it's nature. So let don't stop at this very limited solution. Either did You mean "threaT"? If so can You pls be so nice to proof Your claim? May be You've got a some top-secret notification from Oracle? > The real work has to be done by Oracle. And Oracle did nothing up to now, do You mean this? Anyway the key question still very clear: are this so called "security" (blocklisting) decisions based on the real world or just paranoidal "but it's possible"?
(In reply to vitar from comment #46) Everyone can reactivate this plugin on demand. So, whats your point? You are asking rhetorical questions. Contribute, don't ask. I don't need this plugin. But I'm heavily relying on updated Java Runtimes. I support your effort, but not your tonality.
(In reply to forumkurt from comment #47) > (In reply to vitar from comment #46) > > Everyone can reactivate this plugin on demand. So, whats your point? Why is Firefox blocking this plugin and notifying me if the security problem was fixed? Yes it's good that I can manually tell Firefox via a prompt that I feel happy about using it on this site. But why should I need to white list sites at all? I am already getting a pop-up from Java too so why do I need one from Firefox as well for white listing? All my add-ons are up to date including Java. Yet the "Java Deployment toolkit" is still blocked even though it is running the latest version. Can this not be re-evaluated and allowed back if it is fixed. Or can we allow people to change it back to "Activated" which would disable the white listing config. Java Deployment toolkit version 7.0.510.13
Will not reactivate on command. Have tried many times in the past week - will not reactivate on demand. Keep getting blocked and the warning. Java is all up-to-date.
The "click to play" does not work as it is stated. The option to allow does not work and the option to allow and remember does not work. Once clicked (allow or allow and remember), Oracle reminds me that the extension has been blocked due to my security settings...but my security settings say the website is allowed. Even after "allowing" a temporary "unblock" I cannot access the desired content due to a block that cannot be "unblocked" by the user. It appears now that the bug is on your end Mozilla. Would someone mind looking into this please? Thanks in Advance.
Thank you Bradboding.
(In reply to bradbolding from comment #50) > It appears now that the bug is on your end Mozilla. Would someone mind > looking into this please? Please file a new bug report with detailed steps to reproduce.
Thank you very much for the information. I have seen the video demonstrating your support and is correct. Generally they warned me similar questions around 2009 , can not remember the date time, where I indicated that the file host system was modified to download the application or updated. The command referenced is very popular sites for instant messaging , chats or similar. But he's been locked scripts notice of initiation site appears to enable java plugin support . This is where the kit is the question as the site administrator you may control or access your temporary file hosted on your device. As you say , someone with a shared network You can modify the host file system , not just modify your system or programs , but to create a zombie computer , ignoring users affected the dangerous vulnerability, etc. . Many webmasters configured their place flash format and not in java, for reasons more dynamism and safety in places besides vulnerabilities experts who comment here . Anyway I have my settings blocked host file voluntarily and I 've localhost to avoid unwanted intrusion of other friends. C : Windows \ System32 \ Drivers \ etc \ hosts Also as you know you can edit the host file system with a bat . or batch introducing a script. ( notepad) . You can also clean up files and replace the temporary file boot host or initial configuration the host system , friends aid programs as Combofix and file format options at bat . with command scripts . Of course when I refer to scripts a website has nothing to do with java . ( I say that messages appear Mozilla Firefox remembering the difference for help users ) . Great information and very well explained for the help of users .
The "lazy" solution to this bug is most likely the cause of my annoyance with the plug in check over and over and over when starting Firefox. Remove the block, and work on your own bugs please, and at a minimum add and ignore feature to the blocklist system - such as "ignore blocklists created out of laziness". " Daniel Veditz [:dveditz] 2013-06-25 00:54:59 PDT Yes, people running the old versions are still at risk. We should just blocklist the Java Deployment Toolkit Plugin entirely (click to play) since it's not used to run Java applets (that's a separate Java Platform plugin) and is generally unnecessary." I can assure you, that most people will tire of attempting to fix a FireFox Developer annoyance like this by switching to a different browser when they have to search and search for answers that yield no results.
Is this still an issue with JDK 8? I find it odd that -all- versions of this plugin are blocked by default...
(In reply to whytedem0n from comment #55) > Is this still an issue with JDK 8? I find it odd that -all- versions of this > plugin are blocked by default... Please take your concerns to the dev-platform mailing list.
Will you please unblock this? We don't even have the choice to enable it and without it you are quickly becoming unable for many things and even crash all of the time. this forces me to use Google Chrome or another browser and degrades the ability of Firefox which I would prefer to use. There is no heightened security threat by using the Java deployment kit on Firefox any more than there is on any other browser. You are only going to lose loyal users by keeping this banned and as of this morning you have it where it cannot be enabled in my 28 or 28.1 browser. Ty, A11
Ty, Your request is one of many for months now. I just use IE now and uninstalling Firefox. That is my suggestion to you.
Because of this blockade i can not use the virtual keyboard of an online phone service, as unlocks? This only caused me trouble. >:(
(In reply to Rada from comment #59) > Because of this blockade i can not use the virtual keyboard of an online > phone service, as unlocks? This only caused me trouble. >:( As mentioned in Comment 56, this bug is not the place for discussions - please go to the dev-platform mailing list https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/dev-platform
Lukas Blakk: "As mentioned in Comment 56, this bug is not the place for discussions - please go to the dev-platform mailing list https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/dev-platform" Lukas - This bug is clearly where the original issue, which was FIXED LONG AGO by Oracle, was discussed and where the arguably heavy-handed "solution" was discussed and agreed upon. The "warning" that is raised is undeniably extremist and casts serious aspersions upon Oracle, and Java in general. The wording that appears is: "Java Deployment Toolkit (click-to-play) has been blocked for your protection. Why was it blocked? The Java Deployment Toolkit plugin is known to be insecure and is unnecessary in most cases. Users should keep it disabled unless strictly necessary." KNOWN TO BE INSECURE!??? It was a single bug in a long-dead release of the toolkit. THIS INACTION BY FAIRLY AMATEUR (wannabe perhaps) DEVELOPERS SEEMS TO BE POLITICAL IN NATURE. I'm a s/w developer of a couple decades - from Sybase SQLSvr, network solutions to weblogic then BEA and on the JRockit jvm team. I've also been a loyal and enthusiastic user of Firefox since it was Mozilla and was spawned from Netscape eons ago. I have continued to defend Firefox through various stages and phases - and believe it's achieved amazing things. But - I do not understand the total pushback and unwillingness for anyone on this team to accept responsibility for this. IT IS TIME FOR THE WORDS "known to be insecure" which were poorly chosen to begin with to go, along with this block. I applaud the efforts that went in to determining this issue and Neal's work with repro environ and offering it to interested parties, etc.. but now this seems more like an unprovoked slap-in-the-face to Oracle (I'm not a big fan -- but Java is still an important technology, imho - and that's the real victim here - Java itself. Clearly, even though the folks that decided upon the hammer-as-a-screwdriver approach don't think so, there are people who continue to make use of the toolkit - and rather than be put-off to Java, they will simply be put-off to FIREFOX. If that's ok with everyone, then by all means continue to look the other way. THIS BUG IS WHERE THE DISCUSSION WAS, AND WHERE THE DECISION TO BLOCK WAS MADE - SO THIS BUG IS WHERE THE REMOVAL OF THE BLOCK SHOULD BE FACILITATED. Shine it on if you really just don't care (Lukas, Anthony - yeah, you guys). Stephen Francis
Stephen, Bugzilla is not the right place to have this discussion. Your concerns are quite valid but should be posted to the dev-platform mailing list. If we ever entertain the proposal to remove this block it will not happen in this bug. The discussion will happen on dev-platform and the implementation of the removal will happen in a new bug on Bugzilla. Respectfully, please take your concerns to dev-platform. Thank you
Hello, I agree with what Stephen is saying above, and he states it much better than what I can in the amount of time I have. Lets try to look at this same issue from a slightly different perspective. Google learns of a security vulnerability in Firefox 2.0 in June 17th, of 2008 (http://dvlabs.tippingpoint.com/blog/2008/06/18/vulnerability-in-mozilla-firefox-30). And places an "advisory" and a "block" of users who are using Firefox*.*.* and attempting to locate and download Firefox*.*.*. Firefox identifies and fixes the bug and releases an update in 2 days and yet in 2014, we are still seeing the "advisory" and still having to use search engines other than Google in order to locate Firefox*.*.*. and its download sites. Then Google states please do not post on the initial article that initiated "defcon 4" against Firefox, please use this site in dev.platform.obscureville.com. PS Firefox is insecure! Be careful! As an end user, why should myself or others go to a site designed for developers. The simple fact is this, if I have to tell a developer that the practice(s) they are following are not logical in any way... I can only hope that they are soon out of a job. Furthermore, I can only surmise that by "encouraging" people to jump through hoops to rectify an issue that started with this very web page, is just a polite way of telling us to bug off. (pun intended :) ) You do not close a street because of a pothole, you simply patch the pothole and move on. The choices made in regard to this bug were created from nothing but pure laziness. You closed the street the pothole was fixed. Yet you have others sit watch to assure it stay closed? Status: NOT RESOLVED IMPROPER FIX IMPLEMENTED Root Causes: laziness/arrogance/egotism "If we ever entertain the proposal to remove this block..." from Anthony Hughes sums up the attitude here perfectly. Obviously you all have an "agenda" and are simply hiding behind artificial procedures because it makes you feel good. However, the main point here is that your initial action and continuing non-action to correct the issue started here are detracting from the Firefox user experience in a negative way on a continuing basis. You are at fault, not Java, not Oracle, you. A (real) developer would not be "ok" with that - only those who want to play politics and pretend to be proffesional [sic] developers are. Respectfully, enjoy your short careers!
Just uninstall - I did. They are too full of themselves to admit they made a mistake.
Please move this discussion to the dev-platform mailing list, as previously requested. Thank you.
Very interesting stuff, ladies and gentlemen. Of particular interest is the instruction provided earlier, to refer to the Bugzilla etiquette page, contrasted with a later (repeated instruction)to move this "discussion". And then if one actually DOES read the etiquette page we find the following: "...Please place all information relating to bugs in the bug itself." Yes, all very interesting. Also, before it is brought up, there is no violation of point #1, No Pointless Comments. This comment has a point. The point is that this nuisance, now well documented right here for over 3 years, has not been resolved satisfactorily. Users questions have not adequately been answered. And yet another user is on the verge of going back to IE, full time, rather than part time. If this isn't enough of a concern to address here more adequately than it has, perhaps it will be addressed via some other means. Perhaps I and others should follow the etiquette page, Section 3. Applicability that reads "In the case of persistent offending you should ping an administrator on Mozilla IRC in channel #bmo and ask them to look into it."
I think we've been very reasonable, respectful, and patient having offered a solution to moving forward on this. For the last time, if you want to engage in a rational conversation about this then please start a dev-platform thread. If all you want to do is vent your frustration, by all means, continue to comment on this bug.
Comment on attachment 8359173 [details] firefox.exe well i need help to get this unblocked or get another plugin
(In reply to janeen from comment #69) > Comment on attachment 8359173 [details] > firefox.exe > > well i need help to get this unblocked or get another plugin Please don't attach exe files to bug reports. I suggest you ask for help at support.mozilla.org, we cannot provide the help you need via this bug report.
I must agree with the others that this blanket blocklisting is sheer laziness. How hard can it be to check the Java Deployment Toolkit version and block only the vulnerable versions? Can Mozilla developers not write a simple if-then statement? It wouldn't even require an else part. Anthony; there is no thread about this at dev-platform and why should there be? I seems like a brush-off to me. This issue originated here and here is where the final resolution should be made. You seem to have been in direct contact with them from the beginning so why can't they get back on this like you are and apply a simple solution instead of killing a fly with a shotgun?
They don't know how to do anything but the "shotgun" approach. Don't think they have the knowledge. That is why they get so defensive when we ask for a simple resolution and tell us to go to the correct platform to discuss it. Haven't used Mozilla for months now.
(In reply to Ian from comment #71) > I must agree with the others that this blanket blocklisting is sheer > laziness. > How hard can it be to check the Java Deployment Toolkit version and block > only the vulnerable versions? > Can Mozilla developers not write a simple if-then statement? It wouldn't > even require an else part. > > Anthony; there is no thread about this at dev-platform and why should there > be? I seems like a brush-off to me. This issue originated here and here is > where the final resolution should be made. You seem to have been in direct > contact with them from the beginning so why can't they get back on this like > you are and apply a simple solution instead of killing a fly with a shotgun? Well no one else has bothered to bite the bullet offered up by Hughes so I found support.mozilla.org and (struggled) to Register (not very intuitive process I must say, you have to Ask a Question and the Registration/Login is part of that process) as follows: ======================================================= Question title: Why does Firefox continue to state that the Java Deployment Toolkit is known to be vulnerable. Description/Detail The original issue with Java has been fixed yet FF continues to state the same warning which must be confusing at least to some and a road block for others at worst? So, I'm posting a question, which is really a request that the Devs remove this warning. There's a thread https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=636633 that 'discusses' this and a person Anthony Hughes, QA Mentor (:ashughes) that has said that this issue should be posted 'somewhere for the devs' but didn't provide a link/path to help us get there to post. ======================================================= Hughes calls himself a Mentor? The etiquette says that we should be nice, understanding, etc since the Mozilla Team is "made up of people just like us". Well Hughes is definitely not like me. I would have gone to the site, posted the issue and then shown the link to the thread in my post here. How simple it could have been, and a way to avoid all the distressed posts here.
Huh, That's exactly what I did. Are you reading this Hughes?
(In reply to APraxis from comment #73) > (In reply to Ian from comment #71) > > I must agree with the others that this blanket blocklisting is sheer > > laziness. > > How hard can it be to check the Java Deployment Toolkit version and block > > only the vulnerable versions? > > Can Mozilla developers not write a simple if-then statement? It wouldn't > > even require an else part. > > > > Anthony; there is no thread about this at dev-platform and why should there > > be? I seems like a brush-off to me. This issue originated here and here is > > where the final resolution should be made. You seem to have been in direct > > contact with them from the beginning so why can't they get back on this like > > you are and apply a simple solution instead of killing a fly with a shotgun? > > Well no one else has bothered to bite the bullet offered up by Hughes so I > found > support.mozilla.org > and (struggled) to Register (not very intuitive process I must say, you have > to Ask a Question and the Registration/Login is part of that process) as > follows: > ======================================================= > Question title: Why does Firefox continue to state that the Java Deployment > Toolkit is known to be vulnerable. > > Description/Detail > The original issue with Java has been fixed yet FF continues to state the > same warning which must be confusing at least to some and a road block for > others at worst? > So, I'm posting a question, which is really a request that the Devs remove > this warning. > There's a thread > https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=636633 > that 'discusses' this and a person Anthony Hughes, QA Mentor (:ashughes) > that > has said that this issue should be posted 'somewhere for the devs' but > didn't provide a link/path to help us get there to post. > ======================================================= > > Hughes calls himself a Mentor? > The etiquette says that we should be nice, understanding, etc since the > Mozilla Team is "made up of people just like us". Well Hughes is definitely > not like me. I would have gone to the site, posted the issue and then shown > the link to the thread in my post here. How simple it could have been, and a > way to avoid all the distressed posts here. Well the response to my Question was useless. It suggested starting FF in Safe Mode to see if the problem still existed. How lazy is that? Starting FF in Safe Mode provides no way to check Addons > Plugins. So my question now is: How do we find the dev-platform mailing list so that we can post there?
Quit using Mozilla. That totally resolved this issue for me months ago. This company is not worth it. They don't care. IE may have issues but can at least get someone to respond and give cognizant suggestions.
(In reply to mkeawsh_2000 from comment #76) > Quit using Mozilla. That totally resolved this issue for me months ago. > This company is not worth it. They don't care. IE may have issues but can > at least get someone to respond and give cognizant suggestions. I disagree, your reply reeks of giving up rather than remaining strong. True, Hughes the Mentor, while possibly attempting to be helpful, wasn't. But giving up simply lets incompetent people continue to be incompetent. After all, they aren't likely to lose their jobs and even if they did, they aren't paid, so they haven't lost much other than the rights to brag that they're FF devs. (Well, some may brag, others may try to hide that fact.)
It's interesting to note that Hughes' profile states that he's submitted 729 bugs. An appropriate question would be: "why didn't he simply file the bug himself and avoid all the subsequent posts?" However he's no longer on the cc list so it's unlikely that he'll provide an answer.
(In reply to APraxis from comment #77) > (In reply to mkeawsh_2000 from comment #76) > > Quit using Mozilla. That totally resolved this issue for me months ago. > > This company is not worth it. They don't care. IE may have issues but can > > at least get someone to respond and give cognizant suggestions. > > I disagree, your reply reeks of giving up rather than remaining strong. > > True, Hughes the Mentor, while possibly attempting to be helpful, wasn't. > But giving up simply lets incompetent people continue to be incompetent. > After all, they aren't likely to lose their jobs and even if they did, they > aren't paid, so they haven't lost much other than the rights to brag that > they're FF devs. (Well, some may brag, others may try to hide that fact.) Was on here verbalizing my concerns at the beginning of the year and got responses to either go to the correct place or go to the guidelines on etiquette. Needed to access java and can not do it with Mozilla and could not wait until they got off their "mightier than thou" thrones to resolve the issue. They are too concerned about being right. Had to resort to another browser.
(In reply to APraxis from comment #78) > It's interesting to note that Hughes' profile states that he's submitted 729 > bugs. > An appropriate question would be: "why didn't he simply file the bug himself > and avoid all the subsequent posts?" > However he's no longer on the cc list so it's unlikely that he'll provide an > answer. He is still on the cc list - anthony.s.hughes.
I'm restricting further comments on this bug. Bugzilla isn't intended as a debate forum. As Anthony and Lukas suggested, the place to have this discussion is dev-platform: https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/dev-platform [Comments are restricted to users with the editbugs privilege -- with privilege comes responsibility, so please consider carefully before commenting if you are able.]
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