203914 - Rabobank.nl recommends use of Internet Explorer

Status: RESOLVED FIXED

(Tech Evangelism Graveyard :: Dutch, defect, P1)

Description

[Patrick]

Go to http://www.rabobank.nl

The first page will tell you to download Internet Explorer because some features
may not work using my current browser [identified by the site as Mozilla 1.4].
Haven't found broken features yet though. But still, site should not push users
towards IE.

BTW : this is not bug 148513.

The site claims that of January 1st 2003 features that don't work when using
other browsers or OS than supported will not be treated. Instead users will be
told to use a supported OS or browser.

Ondersteuning
Vanaf 1 januari 2003 zullen problemen die te wijten zijn aan een andere OS-
en/of browserversie dan waar de Rabobanksite voor geoptimaliseerd is, niet meer
in behandeling worden genomen. De helpdesk zal in die gevallen het advies geven
om gebruik te maken van een OS en/of browser waarvoor de site geoptimaliseerd is. 

Therefore this bug will be a wontfix, but filing it anyway for future reference
& searches.

Comment 1

[Patrick]

...and won'tfixing it, per my own comments and per info given on
http://www.rabobank.nl/info/execute/node?node_id=218079.

Will send them mail anyway to tell them that it is a regrettable choice to
"optimize" a site for a particular browser/OS.

Comment 2

[Kai Lahmann (is there, where MNG is)]

move...

Comment 3

[Patrick]

*** Bug 204181 has been marked as a duplicate of this bug. ***

Comment 4

[Patrick]

Rabobank has now removed the "Use IE" nag screens... 

Comment 5

[Patrick]

Mozilla users go straight to main page now. Marking as fixed.

Comment 6

[Mrten]

uhm, that is simply not true.

using 2003102504, a cookie 'browserchecked' is set. remove that (or all the
cookies), and the nag-screen is back.

Comment 7

[Patrick]

Yep you're right  :(
Good catch.

Being optimistic: there is SOME progress. At least now the site sets a cookie
that doesn't expire at the end of a session but after three months. So you won't
get the "nag" screen every single time.

Comment 8

[Patrick]

Setting P=P1
High traffic site and users should NOT be discouraged from using Mozilla.
Especially not since the site actually WORKS if you continue. [which could be a
reason to set a lower priority...but P1 for now]

Comment 9

[u81239]

It doesn't work completely... After logging in to online banking, the initial
page has trouble showing up (you can bypass it by clicking in the menu though).
Also, I had some trouble setting Rabo Alerts.

Still, when looking at their code... it's horrid. It even hasn't got a doctype
declaration (my, my...), the most basic thing of 'em all! I sincerely hope the
people who created the secure login code aren't the same incompetent people as
the web site designers...


~Grauw

Comment 10

[Patrick]

Contacting them seems like a hitting a stone wall. They just repeat that the
site is optimized for IE and that you should switch to that browser if you want
to use their site....

Comment 11

[Patrick]

removing all rabobank cookies and visiting the site with Firefox gives no nag
screen and sets the browserchecked cookie.

Seems like the issue described by this bug ["recommends use of IE"] is fixed.

Laurens concerning other issues, like you describe in comment 9, please feel
free to open a new bug report for that

Comment 12

[Patrick]

(In reply to comment #11)
> removing all rabobank cookies and visiting the site with Firefox gives no nag
> screen and sets the browserchecked cookie.
> 
> Seems like the issue described by this bug ["recommends use of IE"] is fixed.
> 
> Laurens concerning other issues, like you describe in comment 9, please feel
> free to open a new bug report for that

Hmfp, strangely enough, the warning is there for the Mozilla Suite...

Comment 13

[Patrick]

Sorry for the spam: 
"De Rabobank werkt momenteel aan een vernieuwde site waarbij open internet
standaarden meer toegepast zullen gaan worden."

They're working on a new standards compliant web site...

Comment 14

[u81239]

*cheers*

And this so (relatively) short after they announced they would only support IE.
Apparantly they got a lot of complaints about that. Let's see what this brings us.

Comment 15

[Patrick]

Yeah, compare
http://www.rabobank.nl/info/execute/node?node_id=218079 "Operating systems en
browsers"
with
http://www.rabobank.nl/info/execute/node?node_id=218195 "Operating Systems en
browsers"

The first one says 
"Vanaf 1 januari 2003 zullen problemen die te wijten zijn aan een andere OS-
en/of browserversie dan waar de Rabobanksite voor geoptimaliseerd is, niet meer
in behandeling worden genomen. De helpdesk zal in die gevallen het advies geven
om gebruik te maken van een OS en/of browser waarvoor de site geoptimaliseerd is."

The second one 
"De Rabobank werkt aan een vernieuwde versie van haar site, die meer op open
standaarden gebaseerd zal zijn. Zodat het in de toekomst voor nog meer mensen
mogelijk zal worden probleemloos gebruik te maken van de mogelijkheden die de
Rabobank op Internet biedt."

Comment 16

[u81239]

(translation for the sake of it)

The first (old) one says 
"From January 1st 2003 onwards problems caused by OS and/or browser versions
different from the ones the Rabobank site is optimized for will be disregarded.
The helpdesk will in those cases advice to use an OS and/or browser for which
the site is optimized."

The second (new) one 
"The Rabobank is working on a new version of its site, which will be based on
open standards. This so that in the future even more people will be able to use
the facilities the Rabobank offers on the internet without problems."

Only 7 months or so between them. They were pretty much the Dutch pioneers with
online banking, and after a short lapse it seems they now got their sense back :).


~Grauw

Comment 17

[u81239]

Not resolved at all - I still (again?) get the message:

---
Sorry, het is mogelijk dat uw browser de Rabobanksite niet correct weergeeft

U gebruikt momenteel: Mozilla 1.7 (Microsoft WinXP)

De Rabobanksite kan het best bekeken worden op een PC met Internet Explorer 5.0
of nieuwere versies van deze browser.

Ga door naar de Rabobank site »
Meer over browsers »
---

Please re-open bug.

~Grauw

Comment 18

[u81239]

Again: this is still not fixed.

Please reopen bug.

Comment 19

[Patrick]

The warning now has reappered for Firefox as well + comment 18 --> Reopening.


Note that the page saying they'll update their site to a standards compatible
one has been taken off-line, but the other side saying you need IE is still there.

Contacting them again...

Comment 20

[Patrick]

contacted their helpdesk again.

An internet helpdesk contact btw isn't easy to find on their site, and helpdesk issues are outsourced to call-it.com

Also asked for an in-bank contact.

Comment 21

[Patrick]

Got a nice and fast reply from the bank:
"Er gaat zeer binnenkort een ingrijpende verandering plaatsvinden waarmee het begin wordt gemaakt, om ook niet-IE browsers zonder problemen te kunnen laten werken met de Rabobank-website. Het is, voor zover ons bekend, de bedoeling dat deze volgens de W3C standaarden zal zijn. Een voorproefje hiervan is is te vinden op "www.rabobank.nl/spr". Voorlopig begint het met alleen de non-secure pagina's, maar de secure zullen te zijner tijd volgen."

Summarized: they're working on a new W3C compliant site, see http://www.rabobank.nl/spr for a teaser. They'll first do the non-secure pages, later the secure ones.

Comment 22

[Ruud van Melick]

Progress report:
The revised non-secure part of the Rabobank website is now validates as XHTML1.0 strict according to the W3C validator.
The 'nag-screen' that urged non-MSIE users to use a different browser is gone.

Current browser/OS policy can be found here:
http://www.rabobank.nl/particulieren/servicemenu/toegankelijkheid/besturingssystemen_en_browsers/

    * Internet Explorer 5.5 SP 2 op Windows 98
    * Internet Explorer 6.0 SP 1 op Windows 98
    * Internet Explorer 6.0 SP 1 op Windows XP   
    * Safari 1.x op Apple OS X
    * Mozilla FireFox 1.x op Linux 2.6
    * Mozilla FireFox 1.x op Windows XP 

However, for the secure part of the website (online banking and more), only Internet Explorer is recommended (although most of it works fine in other browsers as well), so this bug should probably stay open for now.

Comment 23

[:Gijs (he/him)]

(In reply to comment #22)
> However, for the secure part of the website (online banking and more), only
> Internet Explorer is recommended (although most of it works fine in other
> browsers as well), so this bug should probably stay open for now.

bug 313979 deals with the secure part of the site, as far as I can see. At least, I think either this or that bug can be closed as FIXED now. Kudos to the rabobank for the non-secure part, let's hope they update the secure part soon, too. :-)

Comment 24

[u81239]

> bug 313979 deals with the secure part of the site, as far as I can see.

If that is the case, the description of that bug should be updated.

In any case, I mentioned trouble with Rabo Alerts in comment 9, but I just tried that again and although I don’t exactly recall what went wrong before, I’m not having troubles with it this time, so it seems that’s also fixed.


~Grauw

Comment 25

[Patrick]

Yep, they've put their new site live, that they had available as a preview earlier [comment 21]. Marking this as fixed.

It took a bit of doing, but it's great that the Rabobank made their site Gecko compatible! :)