306827 - winstripe theme looks strange on Windows Classic (after patch from bug 303806)

Status: RESOLVED WONTFIX

(Firefox :: General, defect)

Description

[Peter van der Woude [:Peter6]]

Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.8b4) Gecko/20050902
Firefox/1.0+ ID:2005090201

Bug 303806 - Wallpaper patch for better appearance on Windows XP / Luna

makes menus look bad on every other Windows OS and Theme (Classic in particular)

1. It consumes too much space.
2. It doesn't fit in.

Allthough a majority of windows users probably use XP, this can't be said about
the Luna-(Barbie) theme.
In most offices this will no doubt be quickly replaced by Classic, because that
is what people are used to.

Therefore bluntly forcing every windows user the modified default theme, adapted
to Luna , is not a good thing.

see screenshot

Comment 1

[Peter van der Woude [:Peter6]]

Attachment: screenshot

Comment 2

[Mike Beltzner [:beltzner, not reading bugmail]]

Since bug 303806 came with an implicit approval from drivers to optimize for
XP/Luna at the expense of XP/Classic, can we get an attachment that shows how
winstripe looks in Luna with the patch? I'd like to make sure that if indeed the
choice is made to break classic, we're doing it for a significant advantage on Luna.

Right now, looking at the menuitem and toolbar button padding in XP/Classic in
attachment 194649 [details], it looks a bit like Fitts' Law gone awry. Yes, increasing
target space makes it take less time to hit the target, but the visible target
size hasn't actually increased, and the resulting empty spaces between UI
elements result in the elements looking disassociated.

Comment 3

[u88484]

this is just hideous. needs backed out and not checked into the trunk. The loss
of screen space alone should have been enough to not check in that patch.
Remember there is still a great deal of people that use XP classic theme, and
millions upon millions of users still using windows 2000 especially in the
workplace not to mention users that use 800*600 and even 1024*768 resolutions
and the toolbars now take up considerable screen real estate. 

Comment 4

[Zulith]

I'd just like add that, in my opinion, the new changes do not only negatively
affect Windows Classic; I feel they for the worse even in XP Luna. The
additional screen space taken up by this patch is the same in XP Luna as in XP
Classic.

If we are using IE and other major Windows apps as the baseline for the way
Firefox's GUI is setup, why this dramatic departure all the sudden? IE6's menus
(in particular, bookmark menu) is much more compact and doesn't eat up lots of
extra pixels that it doesn't need.

Call this bug spam if you like, but this is a GUI change many are sure to
dislike and I think people need to speak up so the patch from 303806 is changed
appropriately or backed out in favor of waiting for the *real* fix supposedly
coming for the trunk in time for 2.0.

Comment 5

[Shayne Jewers]

Attachment: comparison on Royale Theme

The compares menus from yestrdays build with menus from todays build

Comment 6

[Shayne Jewers]

(In reply to comment #5)
forgot to note i have search bar on right end of the menu bar

Comment 7

[Aaron Slunt]

Christ it looks like someone puked all over FF. Wow, it decreases the time to
hit the target by what, .02 seconds? Maybe exaggeration there, but is it really
_that_ significant to go and create wasted space in the UI?

I'm all for the 3d-effect, but giving all of this space is downright ugly. Why
should FF be trying to make an exact clone a crappy browser's UI in the first
place? What the hell was wrong with the last theme that it needed to be done
away with?

I really dislike the fact that drivers went in and basically told everyone "F-U,
I want this in, I don't care about you" before actually making sure the patch
for 303806 wouldn't break every other windows os theme out there, or make the UI
look downright horrible. I'm sure many people, especially those still using
800x600 resolutions, would prefer the previous theme, simply because it does not
 crap all over everything in god's creation.

I don't use Luna, neither does many others, so either has the patch apply to xp
if luna if luna is actually being used, or don't apply it at all, or better yet
just back the patch out altogether.

Comment 8

[u49640]

just tried the new build with the patch checked in.

overall i like it (running XP Luna)
some things that where better before:

The menu bar is way to huge (i have my symbols just right next to them)
The Space between the symbols is to much.

i'd suggest keeping the menu changes, but make the icons as they where before.

and a quick compare IE6 - Firefox shows that the IE Icons (in small mode) are
closer together than in Firefox.

Comment 9

[Wolf [:wolf]]

Attachment: Before/After Screenshot with Luna (Silver)

Requested Screenshot of the patch's appearance on Luna.
Includes how the toolbar buttons now look with the padding (when hovered on.)

Comment 10

[Asa Dotzler [:asa]]

Attachment: screenshot of default toolbars on win2K before and after.

Comment 11

[Jim Jeffery not reading bug-mail 1/2/11]

Tab height has doubled, and text labels on the tab are not centered but pushed
to the top making the tab look like a waste of screen space. 
Please back this out, as many are not going to like this change.  Its affecting
more than the just classic/luna...

Comment 12

[Asaf Romano (gone)]

*** Bug 306861 has been marked as a duplicate of this bug. ***

Comment 13

[elfguy]

This is very bad. Not only from a visible point, but simply from an
accessibility point, this will confuse users who are used to Firefox looking a
specific way. It needs backing out big time.

Comment 14

[mark]

plus selected and foreground aren't enough different

Comment 15

[Peter van der Woude [:Peter6]]

STOP commenting

the cause will be backed out today.

Comment 16

[Mike Beltzner [:beltzner, not reading bugmail]]

Ben's backed out the parts of the patch from bug 303806 which affected toolbar
buttons and menuitems, effectively reducing the trimmed spacing. The menubar
highlight changes (highlight instead of 3d-effect) will stay, though. If you're
terribly preturbed about that, open a different bug (and reference it here, plz)

Comment 17

[Scott MacGregor]

clearing the nomination now that the original bug has been backed out. 

Comment 18

[Aaron Slunt]

New patch for original bug has been landed, reopening as this applies once again.

Comment 19

[Mike Connor [:mconnor]]

This isn't quite the same bug, but if you insist, WONTFIX.

Comment 20

[Asaf Romano (gone)]

*** Bug 307652 has been marked as a duplicate of this bug. ***

Comment 21

[Asaf Romano (gone)]

*** Bug 307653 has been marked as a duplicate of this bug. ***

Comment 22

[Ben Darlow]

Although it's marked as a duplicate, since it was asked for, bug 307652 is my
voicing concern over the loss of 3D effect. Spacing issues aside, this makes
menus look horrible under XP/Classic (why would I want an App to look like
Windows 3.1?).

Comment 23

[Adam Guthrie]

*** Bug 311033 has been marked as a duplicate of this bug. ***