338648 - Filters are "reading" mail when I have not. Similar to deleting mail becomes read...

Status: RESOLVED DUPLICATE of bug 306026

(Thunderbird :: Message Compose Window, defect)

Description

[Kev]

User-Agent:       Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.7.12) Gecko/20050915
Build Identifier: Thunderbird version 1.5.0.2 (20060308)

When I manually move or let my filters move mail to the JUNK folder or at all, and I have not read it, infact I have the body view closed.  I know since I upgraded the spammers are getting confirmation now that I have a active account because the mail is reporting back it was read.  (even though the preferences say do not respond to to such requests.)  And suddenly my junk mail has trippled in just the week since I updated....  I just want mail filters or moved NOT VIEWED OR READ to not mark as "not read".  Simple.  It use to work fine.

Reproducible: Always

Steps to Reproduce:
1. Get spam, do not have the message view window open at all or collapsed.
2. Mark Spam as Junk (a filter and part of the program also)
3. Look in the spam folder, low and behold it is marked "read"
4. Scream obsenities (although that does not help it gets my fustration out).
5. Ponder for a hour or more why the hell anyone would REMOVE the protection of marking UNREAD MAIL as UNREAD MAIL.

Actual Results:  
Mail is marked read, spam grows, and I get mad.
Start thinking about outlook again, despite its flaws.
Maybe some other 'spam proof' program.....

Expected Results:  
I want mail not viewed no matter where it goes marked as unread.  Be it to the Junk folder, trash (this one I think you fixed), or other folders.  Be it done with Filters or manually done.  Nothing gets executed or reported back then. Even if it did not I prefer the peace of mind it is truthfully reporting at least to me that I have not read the e-mail if I have not read it.

The Previous built I had did this fine. version 1.5.0.0 (or was it 1.0?)

Comment 1

[Bob Clary [:bc] (inactive)]

Just because the mail is marked read in Thunderbird does not mean that the sender is notified. If you have JavaScript disabled, Remote images disabled and Return receipts disabled the sender should not be aware at all if you have read the email. Why do you think otherwise?

The question is did behavior related to marking selected but not viewed messages change after 1.5.

Comment 2

[Kev]

> ------- Comment #1 from [e-mail]  2006-05-20 10:20 PDT -------
> Just because the mail is marked read in Thunderbird does not mean that the
> sender is notified. If you have JavaScript disabled, Remote images disabled and
> Return receipts disabled the sender should not be aware at all if you have read
> the email. Why do you think otherwise?

Because the SUDDEN increase in spam.  This spam is in a mail box not used but for special uses.  It would get 2-3 per day, suddenly 20-30 after the upgrade.

>
> The question is did behavior related to marking selected but not viewed
> messages change after 1.5.

Yes.  It is a change that occurred when I most recently updated the version from 1.5 to 1.5002 or what ever it is now.  I did not have the option for Update under help in the version I 'had' and now I do if that helps narrow it a bit.

I wish I had written more down about the build, but it did not occur to me anything would be odd.

I did see a report similar, but different in deleting mail.  It would be marked READ when deleted and you could see it in the box.  But this is more then deleting, it is any junk filter or filter for that matter.

100% reproducible if manually done, the marking JUNK that is.

Comment 3

[Daniel Veditz [:dveditz]]

Nothing should have changed in this regard between 1.5 and 1.5.0.2. In my own account my automatically "junked" mail remains unread as does mail that I filter.

The read/unread indication is just a flag intended to be a helpful reminder but its state doesn't mean the mail has actually been read or unread. On the "Message" menu you can "Mark" all or some messages as read without having opened them, and you can mark read messages as unread if that's your style of reminding yourself to re-read it later. Even if you have turned on return receipts and load remote content, if you don't actually open and view the message merely marking it as "read" will not send receipts or load remote content.

If you have receipts and loading of remote content turned off then even if you *do* open the message there should be no indication sent back to potential spammers.

The fact that the spam increase was immediate upon upgrading indicates this was probably coincidental. It takes time between an address leaking and it getting spread around to the spammers. Increases usually do happen in jumps because individual spam groups are responsible for lots of diverse spam. The fact that you got *some* spam before means your address had already leaked, the jump in traffic just means the address got recently sold to one or more additional spammers.

We can certainly leave the bug open to figure out why your flags aren't behaving correctly, but that's not the source of your increased spam.

Comment 4

[Kev]

Do you want me to Video tape it happening?
I could.
It is happening no queastion.

The point is Mail not read is being marked READ.
It needs to be fixed.
Stop belly aching about other issues, this is what I wrote about.

(this is the last I will talk off topic: This is a internal e-mail used for server work, it is not used for anything else. There is no leak as it would never be used for anything else.  Any, I repeat any, increase is beyond normal.  A 10-100 fold increase after something happens suggests a link to any event.  The only event is the upgrade.  And in that upgrade the problem occured of maiul marked read or not.)

Comment 5

[Bob Clary [:bc] (inactive)]

I have Junk set to be moved to my Junk folder and have a variety of filters that move incoming mail from my imap account to various local folders. I do not see them being automatically marked as read in either Thunderbird 1.5.0.4 or in Thunderbird 2.0 on Windows XP.

Please check your Junk mail setting and your Filter actions to make sure you do not have Mark as Read set on either.

Comment 6

[Daniel Veditz [:dveditz]]

(In reply to comment #4)
> Do you want me to Video tape it happening?
> I could. It is happening no queastion.

The question is not "are you lying?" -- why the hell would you? The problem is that if it's not happening to anyone else then we need to figure out what's different about your situation before we know where to look.

Maybe it *is* happening to other people, you might pop into the MozillaZine forums or mozilla newsgroups (listed at http://www.mozilla.org/support/ and see if more people are experiencing this. If so there's a much better chance of figuring out the common cause.

> The point is Mail not read is being marked READ.
> Stop belly aching about other issues, this is what I wrote about.

You're the one that brought up the spam increase, and there is no way that is connected to your mail being mis-marked. I agree, let's stick to the first issue.

Comment 7

[Mike Cowperthwaite]

Bug 306026 is about the behavior change between 1.0 and 1.5 where manually-marked junk was getting marked read (this was a deliberate change: bug 220933).
This cannot be overridden at the moment, but the behavior will be optional in TB 2.0.

Bug 193625 added the option, before 1.0, to mark detected junk as read.  Seamonkey has a checkbox for this option; Thunderbird 1.5 does not, but it's been added for 2.0 (bug 253234).  By default, this option is Off -- detected junk is left Unread unless you change the option.

*** This bug has been marked as a duplicate of 306026 ***