603996 - (fx40-p12n-nl) [nl] Firefox 4.0 productization review for Dutch

Status: RESOLVED FIXED

(Mozilla Localizations :: nl / Dutch, defect)

Description

[Staś Małolepszy :stas]

As you might have seen in the newsgroups or on the Mozilla blog, there's a couple of changes to search engines planned for the 4.0 release for en-US: <http://groups.google.com/group/mozilla.dev.l10n/msg/81073d8d67e1c4c3>. We would like to use this opportunity to review the current productization setup for Dutch and make any changes that you think will be good for our users.

What is a productization review?
================================

Here's what we're interested in:
* search engines,
* protocol handlers,
* feed readers,
* live bookmark.
You can see what your locale currently ships with at <http://hg.mozilla.org/l10n/l10n-src-verification/file/default/reference/browser/2.0/nl>

Please take a moment and review the choice of services available by default in your locale. If there have been any new services that have recently gained popularity and that offer good value for the users, please suggest adding them to your locale. On the other hand, if there are services that lost credibility (e.g. display too many adds) or have poor user experience, consider suggesting that we remove them. If in doubt, feel free to make a suggestion and we'll look at it together. You might find the guidelines at <https://wiki.mozilla.org/L10n:Productization> and <https://wiki.mozilla.org/L10n:Firefox/Productization> helpful, too.

Required changes
================

There's two things I would like to draw your attention to (if applicable):

1) if you have a google.xml file in your `searchplugins` directory, please remove it,

2) Bloglines is closing down on November 1st and we need to remove it from the feed reader options for all locales (see bug 595485). We suspect that it will make sense to move Google Reader up to the first position (if your locale has it). We will be offering technical help with this change, either in form of ready-made patches or a mass-landing by one of the l10n-drivers. If you don't think that moving Google Reader up is a good idea for your locale, please let us know!

Changes in en-US and en-GB
==========================

Here's the changes that we will be making in en-US and en-GB:
* add Bing as the 3rd general search engine (see bug 603298),
* remove Answers,
* remove Creative Commons.

We're making these changes in en-US and en-GB because we feel that they follow the recent market trends and user preferences in the US and the UK. We would like to go through the same thought process for your locale and see if any of these changes would make sense in Dutch builds as well. If you decide that implementing these changes would be in your users' best interest then please go ahead and include them in the patch you'll attach to this bug.


Implementation
==============

Please make suggestions for changes and attach patches that Seth, Axel or I will review. Please note that since Bing provides a global plugin which does the locale detection itself, you will only need to add "bing" to your list.txt if you decide to include it. The XML file will be automatically pulled from en-US.

Once a review is granted, you can land the patch on l10n-central if your locale actively maintains it. Otherwise, please wait for further instructions which will be put in the comments of this bug and announced in mozilla.dev.l10n (we're still unsure when the branching will happen). Please do not land any changes except for the required ones (google.xml, Bloglines) on 1.9.2.

If you do not wish to make any changes, let us know, and we'll only work on removing Bloglines.

Thanks!

Comment 1

[Tim Maks van den Broek [:mad_maks]]

Attachment: add bing remove bloglines

Bing has a marketshare of 1% in nl (http://gs.statcounter.com/#search_engine-NL-monthly-200909-201009-bar) but it is bigger then Yahoo! 

list.txt:
google
bing
yahoo-nl
bolcom-nl
vandale-nl
wikipedia-nl
marktplaats-nl

changes region.properties

remove bloglines and move google to the first position

Comment 2

[Seth Bindernagel]

Look like this is a patch for l10n-central, right? Can you prepare a patch for 1.9.2 that removes Bloglines?  See Stas's comment:

(In reply to comment #0)
> Required changes
> ================
> 
> There's two things I would like to draw your attention to (if applicable):
> 
> 1) if you have a google.xml file in your `searchplugins` directory, please
> remove it,
> 
> 2) Bloglines is closing down on November 1st and we need to remove it from the
> feed reader options for all locales (see bug 595485). We suspect that it will
> make sense to move Google Reader up to the first position (if your locale has
> it). We will be offering technical help with this change, either in form of
> ready-made patches or a mass-landing by one of the l10n-drivers. If you don't
> think that moving Google Reader up is a good idea for your locale, please let
> us know!

Comment 3

[Seth Bindernagel]

Comment on attachment 483446 [details] [diff] [review]
add bing remove bloglines

Is this for l10n-central? Please confirm before we r+.

Comment 4

[Seth Bindernagel]

Also, since yahoo has less than 1% market share in nl, should we just remove it altogether?

Comment 5

[Tim Maks van den Broek [:mad_maks]]

Attachment: changes to region.properties 1.9.2

Here a patch for 1.9.2 without adding bing

the previous patch is indeed for central (firefox 4 is central....)

Comment 6

[Tim Maks van den Broek [:mad_maks]]

(In reply to comment #4)
> Also, since yahoo has less than 1% market share in nl, should we just remove it
> altogether?

That is ok with me, what does the other nl team members think?

Comment 7

[Ton [:Tonnes]]

(In reply to comment #6)
> (In reply to comment #4)
> 
> That is ok with me, what does the other nl team members think?

It’s fine with me.

Comment 8

[Tim Maks van den Broek [:mad_maks]]

Comment on attachment 483449 [details] [diff] [review]
changes to region.properties 1.9.2

i think that for 1.9.2 we only remove bloglines and leave yahoo as it is. For central/firefox 4.0 we can remove yahoo as suggested

Comment 9

[Axel Hecht [:Pike]]

Comment on attachment 483449 [details] [diff] [review]
changes to region.properties 1.9.2

Moving the review request over to Seth.

Comment 10

[Seth Bindernagel]

Comment on attachment 483449 [details] [diff] [review]
changes to region.properties 1.9.2

This looks good.  Please land on 1.9.2 and add a comment that references bug 603996 and this change.

Comment 11

[Seth Bindernagel]

Comment on attachment 483446 [details] [diff] [review]
add bing remove bloglines

This is a small nit, but can you remove the "\ No newline at end of file" at the end of your list.txt file?  I'll approve this once that change is made.  Thanks and sorry for the small request.

Comment 12

[Tim Maks van den Broek [:mad_maks]]

(In reply to comment #10)
> Comment on attachment 483449 [details] [diff] [review]
> changes to region.properties 1.9.2
> 
> This looks good.  Please land on 1.9.2 and add a comment that references bug
> 603996 and this change.

http://hg.mozilla.org/releases/l10n-mozilla-1.9.2/nl/rev/000357c42b5c

Comment 13

[Tim Maks van den Broek [:mad_maks]]

Attachment: add bing remove bloglines / yahoo

(In reply to comment #11)
> Comment on attachment 483446 [details] [diff] [review]
> add bing remove bloglines
> 
> This is a small nit, but can you remove the "\ No newline at end of file" at
> the end of your list.txt file?  I'll approve this once that change is made. 
> Thanks and sorry for the small request.

here is a new pach. I also removed yahoo as in comment 4

Comment 14

[Seth Bindernagel]

Comment on attachment 488435 [details] [diff] [review]
add bing remove bloglines / yahoo

This looks good and thanks.  Please land this on l10n-central *only*.  Please add a comment to your landing that references bug 603996 and the changes made.

Comment 15

[Tim Maks van den Broek [:mad_maks]]

http://hg.mozilla.org/l10n-central/nl/rev/efb650b7bc9a

Comment 16

[Tim Maks van den Broek [:mad_maks]]

In the nightly downloaded today are the searchengines a mess:
amazon
answers
bing
bolcom-nl
creativecommons
ebay
google
marktplaats-nl
vandale-nl
wikipedia-ar 
wikipedia-nl
yahoo
yahoo-nl

while the list.txt is:
google
bing
bolcom-nl
vandale-nl
wikipedia-nl
marktplaats-nl

is this a problem for the nightly and would it be ok in the beta?

Comment 17

[Ton [:Tonnes]]

FWIW, they were OK here yesterday, as well as today (win).

Comment 18

[Tim Maks van den Broek [:mad_maks]]

(In reply to comment #17)
> FWIW, they were OK here yesterday, as well as today (win).

With a clean new profile?

Comment 19

[Ton [:Tonnes]]

(In reply to comment #18)

> With a clean new profile?

Oops, no… Today’s is though.

Comment 20

[Seth Bindernagel]

Are you still seeing the problem?  I don't see the massive list of plugins listed in comment 16 when I check l10n-central here:

http://hg.mozilla.org/l10n-central/nl/file/default/browser/searchplugins

Comment 21

[Seth Bindernagel]

This seems OK for now.  Reopen if you have any problems or other suggestions for productization changes for Firefox 4.

Comment 22

[Tim Maks van den Broek [:mad_maks]]

The list is almost ok in build: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:2.0b8pre) Gecko/20101121 Firefox/4.0b8pre

the only thing is that we removed yahoo but it is still there.

Comment 23

[Seth Bindernagel]

I found out from Axel that this is an issue with the removed-files.in.  Yahoo is not in removed-files.in, so a user won't see Yahoo only if he/she installs from scratch.  This is the same problem with CC and answers in en-US.  And, we can't add Yahoo to removed-files.in as long as there is one locale still using it.

Marking fixed.

Comment 24

[Staś Małolepszy :stas]

https://hg.mozilla.org/l10n/l10n-src-verification/rev/4df8137a9d3d