Closed Bug 743746 Opened 12 years ago Closed 12 years ago

Create a localized Portuguese and Croatian version of the Get Involved page

Categories

(www.mozilla.org :: General, defect)

Product:
www.mozilla.org
Component:
General
Type:
defect
Priority:
Not set
Severity:
normal

Tracking

(Not tracked)

Status:
VERIFIED INVALID

People

(Reporter: davidwboswell, Unassigned)

References

(
URL
)

Details

Now that the Get Involved page has been migrated to Bedrock, we can look into localizing the page.  There are some open questions about the best way to do this, so our thinking is to create a pilot localization to try some things out to see what model works best.

Opening this bug as a place for us to start getting our thinking together about how to do that.
Croatian L10n team can localize that page, but I see that nothing else around that Get Involved page is localized.

Not sure how would localized Get Involved fit in.
(In reply to Nikola Matosović from comment #1)
> Croatian L10n team can localize that page, but I see that nothing else
> around that Get Involved page is localized.

For background, the old www.mozilla.org infrastructure couldn't really handle localized content, so that page has never been in anything other than English.
 
> Not sure how would localized Get Involved fit in.

It would be great to get your help sorting these open questions out.  I don't think this is as simple as just translating the English version.  

For instance, the contribution opportunities for someone visiting the page from Croatia may be different from those for someone visiting from somewhere else.

Also, with the lead generation process that puts people directly in touch with each other, we'll need to make sure that someone asking in Croatian about how to get involved will be put in touch with someone who can respond in Croatian.  Doing this in a scalable way will be something we'll need to play around with.

A good next step would be to do an initial mock-up of what a Croatian version of the page could look like.  Pierros has offered to put something together that we can review and provide thoughts and suggestions about.
(In reply to David Boswell from comment #2)

> It would be great to get your help sorting these open questions out.  I
> don't think this is as simple as just translating the English version.  

Agree, but, I'm not sure on what exactly can we "influence" and what are those
things we have liberty to adapt.

> For instance, the contribution opportunities for someone visiting the page
> from Croatia may be different from those for someone visiting from somewhere
> else.

... which could, in that case, also serve as some kind of extension of our website.
(in sense of finding possible ways to join us and contribute)
Or, maybe better to say, another page where they can also find that info, except just on our website.

> 
> Also, with the lead generation process that puts people directly in touch
> with each other, we'll need to make sure that someone asking in Croatian
> about how to get involved will be put in touch with someone who can respond
> in Croatian.  Doing this in a scalable way will be something we'll need to
> play around with.

What I can do is provide all needed info for setting that up, like emails, social network accounts or whatever else is considered as appropriate.
Also, I could maybe give advice what to include (as different countries/regions find different networks and channels more or less popular (Twitter isn't really popular in Croatia)).

> 
> A good next step would be to do an initial mock-up of what a Croatian
> version of the page could look like.  Pierros has offered to put something
> together that we can review and provide thoughts and suggestions about.

Should I get in touch with Pierros about that, or?
(In reply to Nikola Matosović from comment #3)
> Agree, but, I'm not sure on what exactly can we "influence" and what are
> those things we have liberty to adapt.

At this point, I think we can adapt anything on the page.  If we approach this as a pilot, we can give anything a try and then see what works and what doesn't.  We can then package up what works best and use that as a model for other localizations of the page.
 
> ... which could, in that case, also serve as some kind of extension of our
> website.
> (in sense of finding possible ways to join us and contribute)
> Or, maybe better to say, another page where they can also find that info,
> except just on our website.

Good point.  I'd like to avoid duplicating anything already going on at a local community's site.  I see the opportunity here as a way to help direct people to the right place and in many cases that will be the local community site.

For example, it's always been hard for someone to find a nearby local community site by going to www.mozilla.org and clicking around.  Hopefully this will be a way to surface those sites better.

As someone who is involved with a local Mozilla site, it would be great to get your feedback about what's the right balance here and what content works best on www.mozilla.org vs. the local site.

> What I can do is provide all needed info for setting that up, like emails,
> social network accounts or whatever else is considered as appropriate.
> Also, I could maybe give advice what to include (as different
> countries/regions find different networks and channels more or less popular
> (Twitter isn't really popular in Croatia)).

Another thought about how to handle inquiries is to also localize the auto-responses that some areas use with the form.  For example, you could take the English auto-response text for Webdev and translate that and also include specific information about your locale, such as how to plug in to the local community.

Doing this means that people handling inquiries for a specific locale don't need to be an expert in how to get people involved in every area of Mozilla -- they'd just be getting in touch with people who follow up to the auto-response with specific questions.

> Should I get in touch with Pierros about that, or?

Feel free to get in touch with Pierros about that.  We can also all discuss here if that works or move the discussion somewhere more appropriate.  Maybe the community-local-sites list?
Updating bug to include a localized Portuguese Get Involved page into the pilot.  Dealing with two different locales will give us more perspective on issues we need to sort out with integrating regional information and it will have the added benefit of helping get people involved in Brazil.
Summary: Create a localized Croatian version of the Get Involved page → Create a localized Portuguese and Croatian version of the Get Involved page
David, you can count with the Spanish community too, we've been REALLY interested in having this localized for a long time.

We have a lot of information that can be syndicated from our wiki or contribute page, such as incoming events, active contributors, mentors... etc 

https://www.mozilla-hispano.org/documentacion/Colabora
https://www.mozilla-hispano.org/documentacion/Eventos

Also we have also the video already localized here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n0k-JoovPSA&list=UUptBAfmg3ql4AVj9DZ05E9w&index=2&feature=plcp
As a suggestion, maybe you could create a meta bug for the localization of the page and dependant bugs for each locale, I would be easier to track ;)
Blocks: 755351
> David, you can count with the Spanish community too, we've been REALLY
> interested in having this localized for a long time.

Great.  I'm really excited to be at a point where we can work together on this and am looking forward to getting this done :)
 
> We have a lot of information that can be syndicated from our wiki or
> contribute page, such as incoming events, active contributors, mentors...
> etc 

That's great.  This brings up the big question in my mind -- how will we integrate relevant information from different locales?  The contribution opportunities and initial points of contact are going to be different in different regions, so we'll need to figure out how this will work.

Trying things out and iterating a few times to get to something that works was the idea behind doing a pilot.  It didn't seem fair to ask people to localize this when it is very likely things are going to change as we work through this.  If you'd like to help pilot this and potentially try out a few different things, that's great.

> As a suggestion, maybe you could create a meta bug for the localization of
> the page and dependant bugs for each locale, I would be easier to track ;)

Good idea -- I just set up bug 755351.

If you have any other advice about the best way to handle this, let me know.  I don't have much localization experience since www.mozilla.org didn't really have any localization system the whole time I was working on it.
Depends on: 756093
Pierros and I talked yesterday and have a suggestion for how to move forward.

For the pilot, we suggest doing a straight-forward localization of what's on the Get Involved page and hold off on surfacing locale-specific opportunities until we get the basics done.

So, we can localize the content on the page itself and also localize the responses that get sent out to people who use the form.  In the localized responses, we can also add locale-specific information such as linking people to the local Mozilla community site.

For reference, the text of the current auto-responses used by the form are at

https://github.com/mozilla/bedrock/tree/master/apps/mozorg/templates/emails

Note that some areas, such as Coding, don't use auto-responses, but we can get the text that's being used.  For instance, Josh Matthews sends manual replies to Coding inquiries, but he has a canned message he starts with and edits as needed.

We'll also need to update the form to recognize and handle additional languages.  I just filed bug 756093 for that.  We'll need to get Pierros and Giorgos' opinion about how flexible the current system is in terms of adding languages to sort out the scope of the initial pilot (can we add Portuguese, Croatian and Spanish to the form or just one language at first).

Marcio, Nikola and Nukeador, how does this sound to you?

Pascal (or any one else with more localization experience than me), any advice on next steps with localizing the content we have?
I also wanted to add one note about workflow of handling messages from the Want to help form.

The current process goes like this:

* A potential contributor fills out the form and indicates an area they're interested in.  That sends an email to the contribute@ mailing list which is subscribed to by point people from different project areas.  About 100 potential contributors a day do this now.

* Some project areas use auto-responses that immediately send those potential contributors a response.  Other areas have people that manually follow up.  And some areas use both (for instance, people will manually follow up to inquiries that seem particularly promising or contain questions not addressed by auto-response).

I think we will want to tweak this work flow for localized versions of this form since people handling English inquiries now aren't going to be able to read and respond to inquiries coming in from different languages.

So for the localized form, Pierros and I were thinking of this workflow:

* A potential contributor fills out the form and indicates an area they're interested in.

* Localized auto-responses are sent out that contain information about the area of interest plus information about how to connect to the local community for that locale.

* One or more Mozilla Reps in that locale will get all inquiries and can manually respond as needed and can be set as the reply-to for all responses.  Although they will not be able to be experts about all project areas, they can be the first point of contact and can help get people pointed in the right direction.

* Point people for certain areas, like Josh Matthews and Coding, can still see these messages if they want but there's no need if they don't speak certain languages.

Thoughts, questions or suggestions about this work flow?
I have to admit - right now I'm little bit lost in all those bugs and comments. :)

I noticed that there is much talk about forms. Never thought of it as so important.
In my opinion, that will be the easiest part. :)

About concept - I think that this Get Involved page should be starting point for everyone that go directly to it, instead of our community website (or talk to us in person).
Considering that, I think it would be wise to populate it properly - with lots of info (but neatly ordered), and be more concrete about how to help and what to do.

I'm currently drawing (yeah, I know :)) ) my idea so that I can better describe it. :)
Not sure if I should post it here as attachment. :S
OS: Mac OS X → All
Hardware: x86 → All
(In reply to Nikola Matosović from comment #11)
> I'm currently drawing (yeah, I know :)) ) my idea so that I can better
> describe it. :)

Drawing it would be great.  I tend to think more in words, but I know that's not always the best way to present information.

Maybe we can also get help from Pierros to model the form work flow I was referencing.

This is another benefit of the pilot.  We can do this and have a model other people can see in action.
(In reply to David Boswell from comment #10)
> 
> * A potential contributor fills out the form and indicates an area they're
> interested in.
>
> * Localized auto-responses are sent out that contain information about the
> area of interest plus information about how to connect to the local
> community for that locale.
> 
Since many people in Croatia (or even Serbia) are using en-US locale, I suggest adding option to choose for which country are they interested or in which language they want answer.
David, the plan sounds great for me.

Having all content translated is P1.

Handling the form is a bit confusing, in our case we can provide specific infor,ation for each area and a link where to get emails from our mentors in that area.

It would be great if in the future we are able to embed that form in our sites contribute page.

Please use verbatim if the new site can handle po files, it's easier for all.
No longer depends on: 756093
(In reply to Oskar Ivanić (:icecold) from comment #13)
> Since many people in Croatia (or even Serbia) are using en-US locale, I
> suggest adding option to choose for which country are they interested or in
> which language they want answer.

Good point.  It would be good to give people a chance to view contribution opportunities in different areas.  

Like other localized pages, there will be a language picker on the page people can use to switch locales.

There are also the regional maps that can show different regional contribution opportunities for people who want to browse that way.
(In reply to Rubén Martín [:Nukeador] from comment #14)
> Handling the form is a bit confusing, in our case we can provide specific
> infor,ation for each area and a link where to get emails from our mentors in
> that area.

I need to work on better documentation about the form -- I'll also see if Pierros can help visualize how the process works.
 
> It would be great if in the future we are able to embed that form in our
> sites contribute page.

That would be great to let local sites embed localized versions of this form.  

FYI, we did embed the form in another page on www.mozilla.org.  There is a 'Contribute to this page' link in the footer that points to this page:

http://www.mozilla.org/contribute/page
 
> Please use verbatim if the new site can handle po files, it's easier for all.

AFAIK, Bedrock can export content to Verbatim.  I just asked Pascal about this in bug 755351.
(In reply to David Boswell from comment #16)
> FYI, we did embed the form in another page on www.mozilla.org.  There is a
> 'Contribute to this page' link in the footer that points to this page:
> 
> http://www.mozilla.org/contribute/page

I assume that it just work on mozilla.org pages for now.

> AFAIK, Bedrock can export content to Verbatim.  I just asked Pascal about
> this in bug 755351.

Ok, I see that for now is .lang files which is OK since it's what we've been using for mozilla.org sites, in the future Verbatim will handle these ones.

The form replies are also in .lang files?
(In reply to Rubén Martín [:Nukeador] from comment #17)
> The form replies are also in .lang files?

No.  The form replies are in two places -- the auto-responses are part of the custom built Python script in Github that powers the form and the manual replies are with the people responding to specific areas (such as Josh manually replying to Coding inquiries).

https://github.com/mozilla/bedrock/tree/master/apps/mozorg/templates/emails

This situation with the replies is clearly not ideal, but I'm happy to make this more l10n friendly going forward.
(In reply to David Boswell from comment #18)
> No.  The form replies are in two places -- the auto-responses are part of
> the custom built Python script in Github that powers the form and the manual
> replies are with the people responding to specific areas (such as Josh
> manually replying to Coding inquiries).
> 
> https://github.com/mozilla/bedrock/tree/master/apps/mozorg/templates/emails
> 
> This situation with the replies is clearly not ideal, but I'm happy to make
> this more l10n friendly going forward.

So these txt files are also on mozilla.org repository with the .lang files?

If so, it's ok to translate them, I assume the custom script is ready for handling different locales.
(In reply to Rubén Martín [:Nukeador] from comment #19)
> So these txt files are also on mozilla.org repository with the .lang files?

That's a question for Pascal.  I'm not sure what's been exported.
 
> If so, it's ok to translate them, I assume the custom script is ready for
> handling different locales.

No.  We opened bug 756093 to track having the form be able to handle other languages.
Over the weekend an issue occurred with the BMO database which resulted in duplication of dependencies. The dependency issue may have resulted in "Depends On" and "Blocks" values being removed while updating a bug. This issue should now be resolved, however dependencies may need to be manually restored to some bugs.

This bug had dependencies removed during the failure period and will need verification that the dependency removal(s) were intentional. Please help out by taking a look at this bug and adding anything back that was mistakenly removed.
I think the scope of this bug has expanded a bit from doing a pilot with one locale to piloting a few different locales.  

The best practice for l10n seems to be one bug per locale tied to a tracking bug, so would anyone object to closing this and opening three new bugs for Spanish, Portuguese and Croatian localization and setting those as blocking 755351?
(In reply to David Lawrence [:dkl] from comment #21)
> This bug had dependencies removed during the failure period and will need
> verification that the dependency removal(s) were intentional. Please help
> out by taking a look at this bug and adding anything back that was
> mistakenly removed.

I added the dependency back to tracking bug 755351.  As mentioned in comment #23 though, it may be better to close this and open separate tracking bugs.
Blocks: 755351
@david, Yes no problem, I'll be offline for the week end but I will resume work on this contribute page next week and we will open per locale bugs which are better to follow progress in a more granular way.
Commit pushed to dev at https://github.com/mozilla/bedrock

https://github.com/mozilla/bedrock/commit/6584979a2d4f5b9524e1dbc70b4e6e1d91acbe14
l10n: contribute page, bug 743746, remove double spacing in strings that trigger a gettext extraction bug
FYI, I've started documenting who from each locale will be the point person for handling inquiries from the localized versions of the Get Involved page.  This can be more than one person depending on how each locale wants to divide up responsibilities.

https://wiki.mozilla.org/Contribute/Point_people#By_Locale
David, you can list me as a point person for French if you don't have anybody else. I'll check with our French Community to see if more people are interested (if it is the case, we may use an alias email)
(In reply to Pascal Chevrel:pascalc from comment #28)
> David, you can list me as a point person for French if you don't have
> anybody else. I'll check with our French Community to see if more people are
> interested (if it is the case, we may use an alias email)

Great.  I just added you to the page.
Havi mentioned at the Grow Mozilla discussion today that having the Portuguese Get Involved page ready to go in time for FISL on July 25 could be a good deadline to aim for.
(In reply to Pascal Chevrel:pascalc from comment #25)
> we will open per locale bugs
> which are better to follow progress in a more granular way.

I opened per locale bugs for the es, pt-BR and hr localizations we've been talking about in this bug.

Please add yourself to the following bugs and I'll close this one.

es -- bug 760820

pt-BR -- bug 760821

hr -- bug 760823
Status: NEW → RESOLVED
Closed: 12 years ago
Resolution: --- → INVALID
Status: RESOLVED → VERIFIED
Component: www.mozilla.org → General
Product: Websites → www.mozilla.org
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